On this episode of The Western Rookie Podcast, Brian talks with good friend Logan Doyle about everything you need to know about Archery Antelope hunting.
Logan runs the Cant Hunt Enough blog and is a dedicated antelope hunter. Logan has had a pronghorn tag in his pocket for over a decade and between him and his dad have brought home close to two dozen animals. Logan and Brian talk about everything you need to know to shoot an antelope with your bow, from the best blind chairs to spot and stalk tactics in rattlesnake country. If you have ever dreamed about sending an arrow through a big antelope buck, this is the episode for you!
[00:00:00] Welcome back to another episode of the Western Rookie Podcast. I'm your host Brian Krebs, and if you're listening to this, we, Dan and I just got back from our Arizona, New Mexico. Shed hunt with Stephen Walker. But as I'm recording this, we are just getting ready to go. It's April 5th today. We are heading out on April 10th.
So we're just finalizing details and man, are we excited? Dan is gonna bring his podcasting board, so we're gonna try to actually record a couple podcasts while we're driving out there. I'll probably be in the backseat running the board and Dan will be driving and the camera guy and we'll all have a headset.
So we'll actually be able to hear everyone talk pretty well and it'll just be a fun way to record a pre hunt podcast with all the excitement of heading out west and trying to find some elk sheds. But, In addition to that, I'm also very excited tonight because tonight is the first episode that I know of [00:01:00] where we're really planned.
An episode based on one of your comments, somebody wrote in on one of our social media posts and said, great episode. I love that person. Follow their content, would love to see more archery antelope content. And so that's what we have for today is an episode all about archery antelope. So super excited. I happen to have a buddy from high school that's been doing archery antelope every year for a long time.
And so I just see now that he popped in the lobby. Without further ado, we're gonna fire this episode of the Western Rookie Off and talk all about antelope. You're listening to the Western Rookie, a hunting podcast full of tips, tricks and strategies from season western hunters. There are plenty of opportunities out there.
We just need to learn how to take on the challenges. Hunting is completely different up there. That person, 26, big became animals. You can fool their eyes. We can fool their nose, 300 [00:02:00] yards, speck to the road, turned into three miles back the other way. It's always cool seeing new hunters going harvest animal.
I don't know what to expect. If there's anybody I want in the woods with me, it'll be you.
Welcome back to another episode of Stern Rookie Podcast. Like I said in the intro, this episode is all about archery antelope due to some of you guys listener request and somebody sent in a request to get more archery antelope content, and by gosh, I'm lucky enough to have a good high school buddy, Logan Doyle, that has been doing archery Antelope, I you've been doing it like at least half your life, haven't you?
Yeah, real. It's coming up on, I think I've went out there for about 14 years, 13, 14 years. So yeah, I guess we're getting older, but yeah, that's about half, that's about half my life. Yeah. Yeah. You guys have been you and your dad, right? Typically? Yes. Yep. Yeah, I remember we've been seeing the, seeing you guys post an antelope [00:03:00] like in your high, like in high school, and it's like archery antelope.
What, like you, I didn't like back then, like hunting the west wasn't even really on my radar yet. And I'm like, you going all the way up there shooting antelope with your bow, like that seems hard. It's it is definitely a challenge, but the best thing about it is a lot of states open up, I think South Dakota is the third Saturday in August, so that, it varies in South Dakota, but in Montana where we usually go, it's August 15th.
So you get a jump on season because depending, where we grew up in Minnesota, deer season doesn't open till the middle to second half of September. South Dakota where I live now, open September 1st, but you get extra couple weeks of hunting if you pick up Archer Antelope. So it's just a great way and just a great kickoff to most art most of my seasons nowadays.
Yeah. I heard, I read your articles that you sent about some of the write-ups you've done and you talk about, being able to just get back in the groove, fire an arrow, draw some blood, and I'm like, yeah, that does sound good because what we do, we've been doing archery.
Almost every year for the last [00:04:00] seven years. But when you're doing archery elk, we're always heading out like that 15th week of September. And so it's like the first animal that I might draw blood on is gonna be an elk, like the biggest one. And it's that's not a great way to start. And like you said our like our deer season doesn't open until that week.
And so I don't even get to hunt until I get back and it'd be like really nice to smack a couple doughs and just get back in the groove before I got a bowl bugle in at 30 yards. Oh yeah. Actually. And it's sure a heck of a lot easier to pack out if you shoot an antelope than an elk. I can promise you that.
Yeah. I've only shot one smaller critter and I shot it with my rifle. I got a rifle doe tag when I was a North Dakota resident and I packed that whole thing out in one trip. Yeah. Like easy peasy. Yeah. So you just seal that sucker over the shoulder after you got it and you're good to go. Oh, I even quartered it just, I just don't want to like deal with the harkess at the truck.
Cause I was, truck camping and But yeah, it was just I've, I mean it got a little heavy. I don't know what a dough antelope quarters out at, but I could tell [00:05:00] I had weight there in my pack. Yeah. But it was like I've never even come close to packing out a whole elk in one trip. Yeah.
No. So not a chance. Awesome. It's awesome. So you guys said you dressed before we started the talk though, I said you guys got pounded with snow again out in South Dakota and I'm sure where you guys antelope punt is getting a lot of snow as well. Yeah I've went the last three years out in South Dakota because drawing tags, kinda everywhere out west right now is a little bit harder.
So we haven't been able to get Montana archery antelope in the unit. We've gone for a while, so gone out just more public land out in Western South Dakota. So anywhere, once you cross the river, the Missouri River in South Dakota, you start seeing anal or whatnot, but we just head close, go west and hunt a couple counties that border up against that Wyoming over there.
But it's just fun to get out there and, but yeah, it's they got pounded with snow and luckily I live in Sioux Falls right now, so luckily it missed us. But yeah, that whole Rapid City area they got. I heard the Southern [00:06:00] Hills got 30 inches dumped on in Hot Springs this weekend.
And yeah, up in Aberdeen and northeast, part of the state got another foot and a half. So I'm lucky that I'm in the southeast corner right now and we got missed out on those last couple storms, but won't be looking for any antlers anytime soon. So I know that for this spring, that kind of put a pause on all plans there.
Yeah. I have buddies that were gonna go out to Eastern Wyoming and do some shed hunting this week and then obviously that fell through. And me and the co-host of this show, Dan Matthews, he's not here tonight, but we are leaving in five days, six days to go out to Durango, Colorado, meet up with a buddy and then work shed hunting New Mexico for two days and then Arizona for two days.
I just put in for my first ever New Mexico elk tag in it's late muzzle loader, so late October. So we'll see if I'm one of the lucky 2% draw statistic odds in that or whatever. But that's one I've never never went after any elk yet. So it's [00:07:00] funny cuz out in Western South Dakota when we're in, not so much lop pun cause it's a little bit different terrain when you're hunting that, but when I'm going after some mule deer hunting, now that opens September 1st I've I've been, I spotted a pretty good mule deer buck and was going down a gully and trying to get to him and closed distance fast when he went outta site.
And I just about stepped on a decent five by five man. He wasn't masked by any means. But lemme tell you, when you almost step on a freaking bull elk that gets your heart going, it was cool. I had the wind. So he busted out to about 60 yards. Looked at me. Didn't know what the heck I was.
And so he came back to about 30 yards to see what I was better off. And so it was cool to take some videos of that and when you're trying to archery mule there and it's oh, this elk thing isn't too hard trying to archery elk hunt. So probably won't say anything to my first elk hunt, but yeah, when you're trying to go after another species it's always a little bit easier for you.
Oh yeah. Yeah. That always happens to me. The opposite. Usually trying to chase down elk and you look over and there's like a 1 50, 1 60 meal. They're just bed looking at you from the [00:08:00] other rig. Yep. It's like they know they're safe. Yeah, it is. It is for sure. But that brings up a good topic. Maybe we should derail for a quick hot second since it is application season, tail end of application season.
But so you mentioned you put in for New Mexico elk for the first time and you said 2% odds and so sounds like you're using New Mexico as a swing for the fences state. Yes. So I've had one of my best friends growing up. He's went down there a couple times. I think he shot a three 40 on the youth season on back when he was like 12, 13 years old.
His first time ever going down there. His dad shot a couple low 300 s bulls as well. So nothing massive. But at least they have some experience there and his dad's always looking for hunts to go on and help out. So he said if I draw, he'd come along and show me the ropes. So I said that's easy if I get free help.
Yeah, just going swinging for the fences. So just kinda learning the point systems. I think I've talked to you about that. I got a couple points in Wyoming. And then obviously I've. [00:09:00] Put, I think I got about five points in South Dakota, but really for archery or rifle, it takes about 15 or so to get a tag to have really good odds.
I should say. I'd getting a tag so you can draw it with less in South Dakota, but takes a long, long while here. So just trying to save up for Wyoming and then yeah, swinging for the fences in New Mexico. So we'll see how lucky I am in a couple weeks. I think that's New Mexico comes out in middle of April, I think.
So that should yeah. Checking emails now coming up. See if I got lucky. Checking the credit card statement. See if anything Exactly. See if I get refunded or if it stays out there. Yeah. I like how you casually mentioned like little 300 s three 40. Nothing too massive.
But it, this is the Western Rookie Podcast, not the Western Hall of Fame podcast. So I I'll say I got a good buddy I met in college. He works out in Washington. A duck farm. They do a lot of, they just a farm in terms of flood and corn fields or whatever. Setting up really good duck hunts out there.
But he sent me a snap the, probably about three weeks ago, [00:10:00] and he had the biggest grin on his face, and I was like, I don't know. Grant granted, they don't, they can't, they don't hunt the farm for any big game animals. The mule deers are just stupid big and don't give. Two hoots about you. He sends pictures all the time and videos of him walking up pretty close to pretty big mule deer and finding sheds or whatever.
So I was expecting him to flip the ch video around and show me some huge, massive mule deer shed. But he flips the camera around. It's a deadhead elk. It was a rocky mountain, elk gross 3 92. And so it was all time, like top 10 out in Washington. I just was looking up, I'm like, dude, that thing is massive.
And yeah, just stumbled upon it. He says, we don't get elk through the farm once in a blue moon. But just was out checking pumps and stuff and just stumbled upon this absolutely behemoth of a deadhead. So yeah, he was gonna clean that up, but it was ma it was maxed. Wow. No kidding.
I've probably tried to find a hide and mount it. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So he is just [00:11:00] he's got it, he's got it made out there. He's one of the few. 2, 2, 3 years ago in this springtime, or maybe it was fall, I don't even remember, get my days mixed up, but he sent a video. He was watching a field that had snow geese circle in and dump in just to watch.
And he saw a hawk come barreling out of the sky, pin a goose and drop it all the way to the ground. So he was looking at it and he is gosh, I dunno what kind of, I thought he thought it was a blue goose right away, but it really wasn't. So he drove up there with the truck just to look and see what it was.
It was an emperor goose, which rarely ever make it outta Alaska. So he is one of the few confirmed cases of getting called the, I don't know if it's the DNR out there or whatever, game, fish, parks, whatever. Asked if he could keep it since it was so rare he was worried. By calling him and being a good citizen that they were gonna confiscate it to put on display just cuz it's so rare.
They don't really get him in Washington ever either, but they let him keep it so he got that thing mounted too. He's just, [00:12:00] between the deadhead and Emperor Goose, I'm like, dude, you're one lucky son of a gun. So he's got stories to tell already. Yeah, I don't know if I would want to use up my luck on finding a dead animal.
I'm already, I used up a lot of my luck to draw the once in a lifetime North Dakota tag as it is. And so yes you did. Yeah, I don't think I'm gonna, I don't think I'm gonna lose use any more of it to find like a world record goose or anything like that. I gotta save what little luck I have and invest it, hopefully can actually try to actually harvest something.
Yeah, no kidding. So getting back to the elk, have you kinda, have you picked a game plan for what your like elk strategy is in terms of points and what states to try for what states you're sleeping on and building points? Yeah, New Mexico, it's just funky, like the New Mexico, it's like you don't really get a preference point.
South Dakota, it's not guaranteed, it's not a true point system where the most always gets it, but South Dakota is that hybrid and the more points you have, the better chance you have. But that's what kind of is intriguing about New Mexico is that, it could be your first time applying or you [00:13:00] could be really unlucky and apply 30 straight years and never get a tag, so the kind of, the what's ki that's what kind of drew me to it in sense that if you, it's good too because some years you have a kid or something and you don't have much vacation time, it's like, all right, I'm not putting in this year. And then you're not missing out on anything if you don't, because next year you have just as good as a chance as the year before.
So in terms of not having any points to help you. So that's what kind of drew me to New Mexico is that haven't been applying or building up points. But and statistically I got just to get a chance as a guy that's really been unlucky and hasn't drawn for 20 years, haven't done a whole lot of homework depending on another two weeks if I draw or not.
But again, I just was, the only reason I even applied for that unit is just because my buddy and his dad have shot four elk over in that unit for last over the last 12, 14 years that they've drawn tags. I think they've had four tags. Two each have had a tag twice and they're three, three filled tags of it.
And they got an uncle who lives down there that is in the area more and is really big elk hunter. So I should [00:14:00] have looked it up. But he has a, I'm gonna, I'll get back to it. I'm gonna send my buddy a text about his uncle owned a nutrition company. A outdoor nutrition company. He's now since sold it, but that's kinda, he's, are you talking kinda well known I guess about.
The Harson Brothers mountain ops? No, because that was an outdoor nutrition company that recently sold Hi. His, he sold it like five, 10 years ago. Oh. But he's, he met some pretty cool pretty cool people cuz of it okay, cool. Yeah, it sounds like great buddies to have if they're like, Hey, we've hunted this unit a lot, we've got some intel, we've shot some bowls here.
If you apply and get drawn, we'll help you out. It's like deep. Yeah, no it's, it pays to know people, and have good friends that will help each other out like that, so Yeah, of course it does. I've, through the podcast, I've already met a ton of great people that we've had on the show and now one of us, one of 'em said, Hey, come out and find some antlers out in nor [00:15:00] Arizona and New Mexico.
And wilderness athlete is what it was called. Oh, wilderness athlete or Wildest Athlete Wilderness. Wilderness athletes, like Yeah I've heard of wilderness athletes yep. Yeah, that's a pretty big company yeah. Yeah, that's a great friend to have in the book. And speaking of points, you said you, you had to go to South Dakota because it's the point system in Montana's been a little tricky.
So for a resident, is that an over-the-counter antelope tag then over-the-counter antelope tag and I guess now that this will be coming out in April, I, we just switched it. He actually was even an over-the-counter non-resident tag, one of the last ones. But we just, G F P, we had some meetings and whatnot, and finally we got that changed.
And so it's not an over-the-counter for non-residents, so we were getting flooded in terms of the, especially the northwest part of South Dakota, it was getting really flooded because people wouldn't draw any other state and would all come to South Dakota. So they changed that [00:16:00] starting this year to, I forget how many.
Non-resident antelope archery tags. There are, but thankfully for residents it's still over the counter antelope tags. Yeah, so that's been my backup. But the last two years that me and my dad haven't drawn in Montana, we did get over the counter. He's a non-resident, lives in Minnesota still.
But he was able to get a non-resident over the counter archery antelope tag as well. So we're able to still keep the street going in terms of at least getting out there and chasing. Gosh, I think I. 12 the first year I went and I'm 27 now, so 15 years. My dad's been chasing every single year.
So I've had to take a couple of years off cuz of basketball and college and whatnot. And, but he's been going for 15 straight years. So it's addicting once you start. And like I said, it's just fun to get out and start the year off. You just, cuz it's pretty much, unless you have a few other states or a few other seasons, it's gonna be your first one.
In instead of August 15th, it's gonna be your first season that you're gonna be able to draw blood and hopefully launch an arrow. Yeah. So would you say [00:17:00] that's your family's like thing? So my family, we've been going to Canada fishing for 40 years straight. Yep. I think we took one year off for Covid cuz we couldn't get in.
But that's our family's like big trip, like that trip happens no matter what. And then lately we've been doing the archery elk, but that kind of bounces between like rifle archery. Some people are in, some people are out. But would you say like the antelope thing is like your family's like outdoor vacation?
I would say so that definitely my dad and I so yeah, I would say fif he's going on 15. I think I've got tagged along for 13 of 'em, so I just said two, two instances I couldn't get away. But it is, it's just, it's fun and it's all, obviously harvesting an animal is awesome every single time and everyone's special.
But just being able to get out for five, five days with your dad, especially now we're older, moved away, live elsewhere. Just getting that quality of time, of just hunting memories with your dad, buddies and other people he meet at camp and whatnot are at the hotel motel you're staying at.
It's just getting [00:18:00] five days alone with your dad who. Kinda, I don't know how your story is, but I'm sure you're similar. My dad I started kinda, I'd say, I joked that he brainwashed me because I was three years old. First time he took me out pheasant hunt, and then he'd get a pocket full of candy.
And once I started getting tired and fallen behind, he's if you catch up to me, I'll give you a sucker. So just bribing him with sugar and whatnot. I've been hunting with my dad since I was three years old. That's something that we definitely have in common. That's our, yeah.
What we love to do. Is that the, does he still do that? If he, if you got my antelope, I'll give you a sucker. I'd like to say that I've passed him and I hope I'm in better shape than him now, and I gotta bribe him to stay up keep up with me, but some days are better than others, so he had to, this past fall I drew a.
My dad and his best friend from high school, they drew whitetail tags out in Western South Dakota, where I've been going, where we go punt and whatnot. And I drew a rifle, mule deer tag. So it was my first rifle tag. I've been going out there for three [00:19:00] years for archery mule deer. Me and my two really good buddies I met in college.
We always go over their Labor day, so get openings, so chase and Velvet, mule deer is what we do out there. But finally was able to get a rifle mealier tag, which takes a couple years and depending on what county you go on or whatnot, but shop mine four and a half miles from the truck. And and it just snowed.
So it was about six inches snow on the ground too. Granted, this isn't, I'm not in the Montana, Wyoming back roads where I'm going up and down mountains, by any means. They're just big hills. But we were trying to pack out a full meal there in one, one go, and it was a pretty big one. He was upper one 40, so that was my biggest meal there to date.
So I. Was gun, did a sh doing a shoulder amount on him too but yeah, he had to come save my butt. I was about two and a half miles back towards the truck and I was just dying. So he had to hike in and help switch, take a pack of meat out with me. So I did. I was, I'm so outta shape, I thought being a college athlete, oh, I'm in such good shape, volleyball, but then, yeah, you're packing a whole deer out, especially [00:20:00] meal deer.
Whitetails are one thing, but you shoot a mature meal, deer buck, there's a lot of meat on those suckers. Yeah, especially when you save the hide and the antlers and then it's snow. And so the hides full of water and. Yeah, it was so yeah, he had to come save me, so he he's, yeah, I guess he had to bribe me to get me those last two, two miles to go cuz I was hurting.
Yeah, that's the, that's one good thing about hunting antelope. You never have that problem, typically. Exactly. From what I can tell. Yeah. You either drive the side by side right up to 'em or it's, a short stones throw away from an oil road or something. Yep. Yep. Yeah. So is your dad from the article I read, I don't remember exactly when that article was published, but at the time it was published on your website, can't Hunt enough, your dad was batting a thousand.
He was, he's still batting a thousand in Montana. You had to start putting, had to start putting conditions on it. Yeah, my dad is 13 for 13 in Montana. But it's been a tough couple [00:21:00] years in South Dakota. So two years ago we just had a severe, Severe drought. And so numbers were down, but also wasn't so much numbers were down, as in there just wasn't any cover.
It was, everything was dead and about an inch high, just nothing grew. So that added more wrinkles to it. And this pasture, it went out and really wanted to get him one just because I wanted to get his streak going. And plus obviously non-resident tag is a little bit more expensive than the 30 bucks I had to spend get anal tag.
And it, we had a lot of good chances. Really, a couple really good stocks. He sat over water one day in a blind and had about a hundred cows come in. But. Antelope hung up antelope and cows don't really get along. More cows couldn't give give a hoot about the antelope, but antelope were weary to come into water when cows are there. But yeah, we got a couple, couple close stocks and yeah, he had some antelope coming in, but a hundred cows decided to come into water. And when it's 90 degrees out and you're at the only [00:22:00] water within a mile, the cows don't just drink and meander off.
They just throw a pool party. That's how it goes sometimes, though. Yeah, that sounds pretty rough. But 13 for 13 on anything is a that's a impressive record. I'm not even 13 for 13 on Whitetails on our own farm in Minnesota, and we have a beautiful whitetail farm, so it's, that's an impressive streak.
And it's antelope hunting you kinda two main ways to hunt 'em in archery. So usually in August 15th out in Montana or any western state, it's hotter than the hubs of hell usually. So your best bet is to be hunting over a hunting in a ground blind over a watering hole. That's your best bet.
So done in a couple ways. We have, we go with Blue Rock Outfitters out in Montana's, who we've went. But when we're doing it ourselves in terms of the last couple years and month South Dakota just means you're going on OnX and especially the, now that I've won a couple years muled deer hunting and whatnot too.
You know some good watering holes that you think, oh, this [00:23:00] might be worth checking. Drop your pins, come back. So really, if you don't have much time to scout, all you're doing is going from water hole to water hole, looking around the rim and seeing, if you have hoof prints or whatnot, and the more hoof prints usually the better in terms of that they're using it.
That's the first way you can hunt 'em is over water. And the second way is just spotting stocks. And I'd say, granted I haven't hunted elk and there's some other critters I haven't hunted as well, but by far the hardest spot in stock animal, I would say would be antelope, hands down.
So for one, the, they love to hang out in sage flats, and so you don't got a whole lot of cover. Usually everything's short. Antelope got, they say they got eight to 10 powered vision. They can see 320 degrees. So they can spot you a mile away, not exaggerating. They're just, their eyesight is unlike any other, so it's between terrain and their eyesight.
It is so hard to get within a bow range of an antelope, but that's what makes it rewarding too, is being able to, [00:24:00] I said spot and stock antelope's gotta be one of the hardest things to do in North America with a bow, I'd say. It's challenging and really frustrating at times especially when you add weather into it too, when you're trying to spot and stock and antelope and it's 95 degrees out and it's so freaking hot and you left the water in the car.
And it's just, there's a lot of elements to it, but it's so fun to just chase those suckers across the prairie. Yeah, I bet. I bet you don't forget the water in the car too many times in a row before. That's a one time mistake. You figured that out real fast. Sorry I think most people get the ground blind tactic.
Find a water hole, find some sign, put a ground blind up, sit there all day until the antelope comes in and they're gonna go get water somewhere. It's the Sahara Desert out there and they're made for it, but they still have to drink eventually. Yep. And and so I think most people understand that, but you do see, I've seen lately mostly like content creators, YouTube channels, like bigger names if you will, are using like cell cams.
Like they'll go put a cell cam at five different water holes and [00:25:00] then sit at one of 'em, but at least they're gathering that date on the other floor. Should I come back here next tomorrow or should I hit one of these other ones based on what I'm seeing? So I bet that could be one strategy.
Someone, if you have, if you have some cell cams and you got five days, run around first morning and put some cell cams on in some different spots that you think are per. Perspective and then just start hunting and see if you have to pivot. I would definitely say that would be a great way to go about it too, because if it's 90, 90 plus degrees, they're probably drinking every day.
But we've had, sometimes you're sitting out, if it's you hope it's not, really, you really hope it's hotter the better when you're antelope hunting, it's long days. Sitting a blind though when it gets light at 6:00 AM and doesn't get dark till 8:00 PM antelope aren't like white till where evening and dusk are the best.
Morning and night are the best times, you know that first hour. Last hour, it does not matter. We've had antelope come water at seven in the morning right when you get there and we've had antelope water at seven 30 at night, so you gotta sit there all [00:26:00] day. And cuz if you go eat lunch, that's when they're coming.
I guarantee it. So it's, you say, oh, just sitting in a blind and they're coming to water. It's when you're putting 14 hour days in the blind, I mean you, you're, it's all, it's almost as mental as is physical. Cause you're just. Thi looking at the same sage brushes, hoping every single time you kind of glance to the left, something catches your eye and you're, oh, is that one coming in?
Or whatnot. It's mentally draining too when you're sitting there for 14 straight hours. And if you're on a ground blind, day three or whatnot, you're putting in the time too. So it's just cuz you're over water and it's hot out doesn't don't think it's easy. It's not for sure things by any means in that sense.
But I think you're right. I, putting out cameras would definitely be beneficial and trying to see, just trying to go to wherever they're going the most. Cuz they usually like to keep going to the same water hole unless they get spooked or something else changes their pattern. Yeah, and it's, it that kind of touches on a, I guess a topic that I've always it's rubbed me the wrong way when people think you have to do the most badass option [00:27:00] on everything.
It's you're just sitting in a ground blind on water, like you should spot and stock 'em. It's I'm out here to. Bring an antelope home. I want to eat the antelope. I want to I'm here to punch tags. And sometimes I wanna do something that's a little bit more hard and challenging, but it's like you, you don't always have to do the extreme option.
Like sometimes you can just go have some type one fun too. You don't always have to have type two fun. Especially if you're some someone who lives out east and you're only getting one crack at it. At least me, I li am blessed enough to live in a state where I can go chase 'em every year if I want, but it's this is your one chance, or you're only getting one trip planned cuz you gotta travel a thousand miles.
It's yeah, I'd take your best chance and you might have every intention to go sit over water and then well, forecast is looking the heck. Yeah. 90 degrees every single. Week comes, drops in the seventies. Guess what? Yeah, your best option probably isn't gonna be sitting on water. It's just, you never know until the days get there.
What's gonna be your best job? Best option either, right? If you could tell me that, hey, you could sit, I'm an elk hunter and that's typically [00:28:00] running around with a bugle tube, trying to call 'em and spot in stock and every trick in the book. But if you told me like, Hey, if you go sit on this water hole and you give it four days, you'll shoot a bowl.
I'm like, done. I'm gonna go sit that water hole for four days straight. Maybe not every year, but there's sometimes you just want to, sometimes you just want to have fun and do it the easy way. And I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I don't know when it became not cool to do the easy way and punch your tag and bring the animal home.
But you see a lot of it these days and it, that bothers me. It's like you don't have to, but. But yeah. So you get, do you have any tips and tricks? Do these for the 14 day ground blind? Cuz I've done, I don't think I've ever done a 14 hour day in a tree stand. I've done some sun up to sun down in the rut, but by then it's usually, eight hour day or 10 hour day.
So you like what, 90 degrees, 14 hours in a ground blind. I happen to, for everyone listening, I happen to know Doyles on the other side of six six. And so that's a big dude in a small box. Do you have any tips and secrets to, to staying [00:29:00] comfortable in these ground blinds? I'd say you gotta bring a ton of water or Gatorade or whatever the heck you wanna drink because it's, it is, and I don't want to get too graphic in here, but I said, when you got eight, 10 power eyesight, and that's what Deeres u Deer use their noses to bust you.
And antelope always trust its eyes. And you do not want to go outside of that bra. Once you're in it, you're in it and you don't want to come out unless you shoot something or it's dark again. I've not to get too graphic, but I'm definitely peeing in bottles just to make sure that you're not not leaving the blind at all.
But I'd say that. And another thing is usually when you're hunting antelope, you're in the middle of nowhere. So which translates to zero cell reception. So I would say, We bring, I try to stockpile North Amer north American Whitetail. Any outdoor magazine you can find. Don't read anything for a couple months before August.
Collect all the summer issues of whatever you wanna read or find interesting, or bring a book because there's a lot of time with your [00:30:00] thoughts and a lot of time for reading because the other good news is it's not like you're sitting in a tree, stand in the Midwest, in the middle of the trees and you don't see anything until it's 30 yards out.
A lot of these spots, when it's pancake flat and you can literally see a mile in each direction, you're not only gonna, it's not gonna be a, oh, they're here. Oh, I missed them thing. You're gonna be able to read a page of your magazine before they get there, nose, glass, the whole thing and go back. It's not, nothing's gonna antelope do some of 'em walk in and some of 'em get to about a hundred yards.
Kinda look in, stare you down for how feels like an hour and then they can maybe run in that last a hundred to 150 yards. But again, most of the time, depending on where your blind is, you're gonna see that sucker take an hour to walk from a thousand yards to a hundred yards. Because another thing antelope don't like to do is walk very long in a straight line.
They're, I don't know, it's just, I haven't done a lot of Turkey hunting, but I [00:31:00] feel like it's just, they wander everywhere. There's a hundred yards to the right, a hundred yards to the left. That's another thing why spot in stock's so hard because you can't find an antelope. Look at him, see they're heading west.
I'm like, oh, he's heading west. We just gotta get in position a half, 3, 4, 500 yards to the west of 'em and set up and wait for him to come by. Cuz there's a better chance than not. He's not gonna just head straight west for 500 yards. It's they're grazers, they go every which way. And it's very seldomly.
Do they go straight for a long distance? That sounds frustrating. That does very, sounds frustrating. And I've done some ground blind hunting and we've now, we have elevated box blinds and, or even just ice fishing. I have these little cheap tripod stools and I can't sit in 'em very long before I start to like cramp up and because I'm not as tall as you but tall.
Or six two. Yep. You get the stool that's 13 inches off the ground and you're basically in a squat the whole time. Your hips cramp up, your, it just gets uncomfortable. So when you're doing like, Hey, we're gonna be here for [00:32:00] five days, 14 hours a day. Are you guys like upgrading like your chair, you're bringing out like a higher quality chair and Yes.
I'd say we're definitely bringing a higher quality chair, cuz yeah, your butt's gonna get sore. Do not go out with a five gallon pale in collar. Good. I'm. Just don't do it. I'm gonna save you some pain. Now try to get, it's definitely swivel chair cause I'm usually shooting from the chair or, granted like you said, when it's only like 14 inches off the ground, my knees are so dang tall that I'm, I don't know if I'm really sitting or if I'm s kneeling, but combination kind of both.
But make sure that thing sucker is oil too, because like I said, antelope press their eyes more than anything. But you do not want something to finally come within 40 yards after 12 hours and you rotate a little bit and a squeak comes out cuz they'll be gone. But definitely you're gonna want a padded chair with a back rest.
I alternate between, I got a tripod chair thing. And I alternate between that and [00:33:00] especially, like I said, I'm six eight, so I'm looking out these windows having to squat down, hunch down a little bit. So I alternate between the chair and just sit my butt on the ground just so my back is straight.
So I'm seeing out the windows eye level. So it's yeah, it's just, it's not easy even if you think the ground blind option is probably the easier way if it's hot out. But it is definitely still not easy comfy hunting by any means. So I would say when we're out hiking blinds in around South Dakota, we're just yeah, hiking the pop-up ones in.
But lucky the place we've gone out in Montana, they have that. I think the platforms are elevated about six feet. But that really makes a difference too, in terms of just trying to be able to see as much as you can cause it's like I said most places, most waterholes you can see ways, but there's nothing worse than.
It, I'd rather take farther, a little bit farther shots away to be on top of a dam or a levy and have to take a little bit longer of a poke just so I can see. Because you do not want to be in a water hole just to make sure you're within 30 yards [00:34:00] of all the whole water hole. But you're in the bowl and you can't see anything cuz you do not wanna be sitting in the bowl for 14 hours cuz it's gonna be miserable.
Cuz then you cannot read or do anything because they might be on you in 30 seconds. Oh yeah. I would say as high as you can because it's definitely a huge advantage. Yeah, that does sound frustrating. So on the, so that's the water hole blind method. Yep. Which I would agree is probably the most popular one that people go with.
But if someone's listening to this and they're like, you know what, good on 'em. I don't wanna sit in the ground blind. Like I come out west to walk, I want to roam and do the spot in stock. And When you doing that, I know I read the one article where you use the hay bales to your advantage, which for most people doing a public land do-it-yourself option.
You're probably not gonna find hay bales on your W M A or whatever. Forest Service BLM land, right? It's gonna be the sage flat, so you can't really plan on just walking behind the hay bill. So what are you guys doing in a, besides that, like if you don't have a hayfield that's bailed [00:35:00] what have you found that works better than others for doing the spot stock in the sage?
Trying to find the thing about antelope sage flats is that they're not hard to see. They got white butts, they got white on 'em. You're not gonna have, if you're in antelope country, you're really not gonna have a problem finding antelope. The problem is gonna be trying to get close enough to shoot one.
Trying to probably just find solos or doubles sometimes. Antelope, Ru's, middle part middle part ish of September around Montana, Wyoming, South Dakota. And so usually if you're going out over opener in terms of August 15th or earlier season before the rut sometimes they're in bachelor groups.
I had a, we've, we went on a stock where there was 15 different bucks all together, which I'm gonna say the lea, the less numbers, just kinda like when you're stocking anything, the better because[00:36:00] trying to do a stock when you got 12 dough and a buck on ya is just, it's so hard to get within distance of one, let alone 12.
Usually not all the time. Again, in. Middle of August there might be a herd buck with a herd ado or whatnot. And so they might be a little bigger. Not always, cuz some of the biggest bucks that we've seen are gone after my dad's harvested and I have too. They come in alone. So it doesn't mean they're always gonna be in groups or whatnot, but I'd say try to find a solo, an antelope or two or three to go after because it's gonna be easier for that.
I said it's tough to. Tough to go on stocks all the time too because like I said, if an antelope's great feeding west, you can't expect it that it's gonna be west the whole time. You just gotta more so go for land landmarks try to find valleys and gullies and whatnot. I know a lot of people, it's gotten more popular.
I've seen more of it. If you're hunting 'em more so in [00:37:00] September, so September through the middle part, end of September actually, when they're more so going through the rut decoys really work. I've never hunted antelope over their rut before, but I hear it's a hell of a rush because bucks gets super aggressive and they come charging in.
We've hunted always around opener to end of about the 22nd, 23rd of August usually. But even so at that time, the younger ones are getting all. Testosterone up and whatnot. And we've had success in my, in South Dakota this year, there's a big herd buck. He had about 15 dos and fons with him, and there was this one little bit smaller buck that just wa he just wanted some love and he would go up, try to get as close as he could to the do herd buck would run 'em off.
And it was literally, it's 90 degrees out and you're like, how the hell are these guys running for? Literally we watching for an hour straight. And so we actually got my dad had a shot, but both of 'em came running [00:38:00] by 'em at 30 yards and antelope can run 60, 65 miles an hour. So I would shot on the run is not something lawn do there.
But another good thing you can do too is if they're herd buck's, running him off always, he's always gonna go back to his dose. So we've had success too if buck run another buck off, just hightail it between him and his dose. Even if the doee and they run off, he's gonna go right to where he last saw his doze.
And so just trying to get between him and his do is a good thing too. And like I said, my dad had a great opportunity. They were just going about 60 miles an hour too fast when they ran by, when that buck ran back looking for his doze. But I'd say that's another good strategy. He's just always trying to get between him and his dough.
You're not gonna, antelope are vocal, definitely not elk by any means. And we don't have any calls or whatnot. But it's fun to see, hear them making noises when they're run another bucks off and whatnot. And I'd say another good strategy is try to get between him and his dough because he's always gonna come back go back to his dose.
So that's another one of the strategy antelope are, [00:39:00] I'd say some of the most curious critters you're gonna find. Wasn't a successful one, but I've also, we had one that got to around 50 yards. We're busted, we're creeping over hill. Never skyline yourself because they literally see you from a mile away.
So that's the number one. No-no, of not to do. But we had me and my dad are run a stock with our guide. This is when I was first couple years. So I was 12, 13 years old, got busted. Our guy took his sock off, put it on top of my quivers and just solely waved it back and forth. And antelope are so freaking curious that Buck busted us, ran out to two, 300 yards, and he came walking back all the way to 50 yards.
And now I would've easily, it would've been a dead ante. And my confidence in how much better I've gotten as a bow hunter. But as a 12, 13 year old kid, I was not about to attempt a 50 yard shot, but it's, they're so inquisitive and that buck didn't know what the heck that white thing was waving, but he sure as hell was coming [00:40:00] closer to find out.
So I'd say just because you think a stock is busted just try something crazy like that. Like literally put a white sock or anything on a arrow, let it wave. One of my dad, one of my dad's spot in stock kills they were in a sage flat. Not really any sages, pretty much just almost looked like it was an old, almost alfalfa field.
But pretty much just flat ground, not more in shin high grass, ankle, high grass. There's about three or four bucks that were chasing doze around this flat. They were used a hill got within a couple hundred yards. Probably about 200, 250 yards. I'm sitting in the truck watching the whole thing from a half mile away.
And the big buck saw them scurried off with two other bucks in the do. And there's this one one smaller buck, two, two and a half year old. Buck probably had his head down when all this action was happening. Grazing stuck his head up. They were had already had run over the hill.
My dad's thinking this sucks. It's all over and whatnot. This [00:41:00] littler buck was watching him, but all they did is my dad literally got up. The guy was right in front of him and they literally just walked straight at this buck. Every single time the buck put his head down or was grazing or walking, they literally just bee-lined it in a straight line right towards Adam.
As soon as the buck lifted his head and looked at him, they. And they did kept doing this. So antelope, funny thing about them, their eyes, they can see 320 degrees. So their eyes are almost completely at the side of their head. Yeah. And so they can literally see their, you ne if it's all, they almost wanna stare at you sideways and they're getting a better angle from you because when they look at your head on their eyes are so far to their sides of their head, they have a hard time with depth perception.
To see exactly what, so if something's, if an analyst just staring at you straight ahead, worrisome, but might not know what it is, it's really, what's really concerning is when they look at you straight ahead and then they give you a look at you left and they look at your right, that's, they're trying to distance, see how far, judge, how far away you are.
So this buck [00:42:00] will put his head down, whatever, look at 'em straight on, they'd. He'd go back walking, grazing, they'd go out, he'd literally, they closed that from 250 yards. My dad shot that antelope at 30 yards. Oh my God. And when I'm looking at albinos from a half mile away, I'm like, this is close enough.
Shoot, what are they doing? But they literally, they were walking in a field that was, couldn't bend a couple inches over ankle high, and it's just one single antelope and my dad and the guide, and they literally straight lined right at him. And every single time they, he stared at him, they stopped. But two, 300 yards away, all the way to 30 yards.
My dad shot that antelope. So was no decoy, nothing. Wow. Just single style line. He was right behind. Our guide had his rangefinder up and just, that's all, that's what it was. So I'm telling you, that's the one thing about antelope. Yeah, they're gonna run when they finally get busted, mainly.
And like I said, when they run 60 miles an hour, you might want to try to find 'em in the next county, but don't be afraid to [00:43:00] throw one last ditch effort at 'em about waving a sock. If you have a decoy, pop that up. Or literally just walk straight at 'em because they sometimes do not, they can't judge that perception very bad.
And when they're staring right at you, cuz their eyes are so far in the side of their head. So that's a, it's just not different. Cause you do that with a whitetail, that sucker would've been gone, not a chance of staying around. Not a chance. Let you go from 250 yards to 30 in a, there's so wrong with ankle high grass.
So yeah, there'd be something wrong with that. White till. Yeah, exactly. But. They're just curious critters, I would say would be one of the best ways to yeah. Explain antelope to a person. Yeah. So two things that I want to ask about this antelope, cuz I've never done the Archie, I've done rifle, but rifle in North Dakota.
Antelope isn't the true testament of antelope hunting by any means. And so rattlesnakes and cactuses, yes. How do those two spicy critters play into this whole antelope hunting scenario? Probably more [00:44:00] so Wyoming, Montana, but just in general. Yes. I have, More than one time sat right on a cactus.
And I hadn't been picking outta my butt. Very uncomfortable trying to do stocks. It is so dry, especially when you're going out there in August. Everything's so damn dry, sharp. Even the, even not even just a cactus, but the grass is so damn sharp trying to belly crawl through it.
It's tough. But yeah, cactus is gonna be around and I've had many a times you're just holding in the pain that you accidentally placed your pulmonary hand wrong or whatnot. Cause yeah, that's, it's definitely an, a definitely out there. And it, I've sat on a couple, got a couple in the palms, and you're just cursing up a storm under your breath because you're getting actually close to an antelope and you gotta keep it quiet.
But one thing about me, I absolutely hate snakes. I even a gardener, doesn't matter if it's a gardener. I am the biggest baby when it comes to snakes. I don't deal with snakes well So they're rattlesnakes are [00:45:00] definitely out there. So thankfully, knock on wood, I haven't had any run-ins in South Dakota with any yet, but definitely other guys that have been hunting the walk-ins with me have in South Dakota.
Couple quick stories. We were on a hike spot in stocking one. It was literally 54 degrees, like on August 16th. So definitely not sitting wa I would recommend not sitting over water in 54 degree weather. But we are going through this belly crawling. Me and my dad and I look over and there is, I didn't know at the time, but there is a, i, it was over five feet, I swear to god, five foot long.
At the time I thought it was a rattlesnake. Thankfully it was just a bull snake. But I literally, when your belly crawling and you look to your right and 18 inches from your face, is this biggest snake you've ever seen. And you're deathly afraid of snakes. Shit, I ruined, I shit my pants. Yeah. And I ruined that stock.
I literally couldn't, I just yelled, I like, a little girl yelled cause I was so scared. But thankfully it was just a bull snake, but, and it was so damn lethargic cuz [00:46:00] it was 54 degrees out that it couldn't even really away. But we've had two instances where we're climbing up over a hill on a rock pile and you hear it the rattle.
And I said, I am the biggest baby when it comes to snakes. And that's the one thing you gotta, yeah. Thankfully they're just prayer rattlers, so they're allegedly not that venomous, allegedly. And it's they're out there and yeah, in the middle of August too. They're out in full force too.
So it's that's the one good thing about Hunting deer in November out there is that you don't really have to worry about 'em near as much, but yeah, we've had a couple one of the times we actually saw it coiled up out in Montana another time we just heard it and turned back and walked away.
But it's it's yeah, that's the one downside about hunting antelope in August, early September, is that you gotta watch your stepping because we've been on a couple stocks and they're right there. I've heard I've never seen a rattlesnake in my life. I saw one dead one in Nebraska.
I, I want to, I don't wanna get bit, I don't wanna get bit, but I do want an [00:47:00] authentic rattle skin hat band for my cowboy hat with the rattle. We, I haven't figured out how to do it yet, but I want, we had one guy out in Montana. We met on a middle of nowhere, dirt road and he had killed one on the road and sc it.
And so it was literally just like the flesh. And he killed the sucker, he said like an hour ago. And he, you could literally, it was, didn't have its head and it was literally SCN for that. And literally an hour after the sucker had died, you could poke it with a stick and it would still coil up. Yeah. And I, and it's just that's stuff.
So that freaks me out. It freaks me out. That's also freaks me out. But it's like, how can something that's been dead for an hour, you poke with a stick and just still coils up without a head. It's just, ugh. They gave me the, he. That's why so many people cut the heads off. Yeah. Because it's like their muscle memory.
Yeah. Like they still have firing like a central nervous system firing that so they can bite even though they've been dead. So everyone cuts their head off. I would probably try to, [00:48:00] I'd probably try to skewer it with a broad. And it'll only work if you're by your truck. I'm not carrying around a rattlesnake with me and put it in like a bucket with a lid and I would just bring it to the taxi dermis and be like, there's a rattlesnake in this bucket.
I want the hide. I don't care how you do it. Yeah, send me a bill. Yeah, but what the cactus is we've done a lot of Wyoming rifle animal punting in the family because my brother was bringing his kids out. Cause it's such a great hunt for kids. It's fun. You don't have to wake up early. You're not cresting mountains.
The weather's great. You know so many reasons why. It's a great first Western hunt. I tell everyone if you want to try hunting the west, go antelope. And so we're br doing this every year for five, six years in a row with my brother's kids, like my niece and nephews. And my dad starts going with, and man, he sat on a cactus one time and he, like a month later he was still pull.
Barbs out of himself and oh yeah. I was like, just profusely bleeding thin. It was right. It was so close to my right between the cheeks and it was, [00:49:00] I literally saw something out in the distance and I, you always gotta look where you sit. Cause I literally just plop down and it. God, it was terrible.
So it's yeah, it's you. That's one thing that you don't have to worry about really. There's, I guess we have thistles, but that's not anything in comparison. No. Around when you're growing up in Minnesota. So it's it's a whole different ballgame out there in terms of, you always gotta watch where you sit for cactus and the possibility of snakes because they're out.
Yeah they're out there. I've brought a buddy from North Dakota out to that southeast Montana area for a mule deer hunt, and we thought we were gonna yeah, it'll be a tough hunt, but there's mule deer everywhere. That's what everyone says. We'll just try to find like a decent four by four.
Met at 1 20, 1 34 by four. Terrible idea. The, like a three year drought record. Low meal deer populations, record high hunters. We struggled to find a good product. What year was that? Two, 2020. Okay. I think No, 21. Yeah. 21. It wasn't last year's year before. Yep. And that, I would say, cause that's the same exact thing [00:50:00] that, that we were, we're supposed to go on a mule deer hunt.
We were buying points for it in the same southeast Montana, but we were told same as a lot of the mule deer in that area, they migrated out and they still haven't really came back in that southeast because yeah, that drought was so dang bad. Yeah, it was terrible. And so yeah, an hour into our first day, first morning hour in my buddy's got a three by four.
And it's like a hundred twenty five inch, three by four. And he's got this beautiful 1 54 by four in his mind. Never been out west before. Never. He just Googled in YouTube stuff and I'm like, dude, do you not pass something on the first day that you would shoot on the last, cuz this is not the unit for that game.
Yeah. Like you get a once in a lifetime Elk tech shirt pass or whatever you want until you find the one that makes you happy. He passes it, he's ah, it just wasn't quite right. We never saw milder again. And so by day four, day three, he's ready to shoot any legal buck. I've already shot two little mule deer at this point in my life, so I'm like, all [00:51:00] right, I don't need to shoot another little mule deer.
And so we're driving around just trying to find new spots, and we see a fork, a good fork key off the road. He he's working, some, this little draw and there's a hill and it's all public. So I'm like, he's dude, there's buck. I'm like, you wanna go after it? He's yeah, I do.
I'm like, all right, great. Go after it. I'll drop you off here, Cress, you'll go around the backside of this hill. You should cut em off. But like you said, the drought, it was like a putting green, everything. There's no grass at all. And I'm like, by the way though, since you, he, I knew he's like newer to western hunting.
I'm like, you do not wanna skyline yourself. Do not walk right over the top of this. He that won't work. You sh and he's what do you what should I do? Because there's nothing to hide behind. He's yeah, I, okay, I understand, but what do you want me to do? And I'm like, if it were me and I really wanted to shoot this deer, I'd crawl up and over that hill.
And sure enough, he, he's walking, then he's crouching, and then he is getting low, as he's getting closer to the crest, he's getting lower and lowering. He's crawling. And I'm just watching, it's cold. I got my hands behind my Bino baby. I feel like a guide. Yeah. Because I, I have no interest in [00:52:00] this deer.
Yeah. Even if he messes it up, I'm not gonna shoot the deer. And so he, whatever happens, no shot goes off. He stands up. I'm like, all right it didn't work. So I walk up to him, he's great fucking idea, man. Crawl. He crawled through 30 yards of cactuses. Geez. And I'm like I didn't think I had to tell you to look out for a cactus when you're crawling around out here, but yeah, look out for cactuses.
Yeah. And the drought, that's about the only thing that grows. So he had to throw his gloves away. He. Switched pants, like right then in, in the truck and put it on a different pair of pants. Everything was covered with cactus needles. Ah. Because he wanted this buck. He didn't wanna stand up. So he's God, just like you, he was just grunting it out, like taking it.
Yep. His mittens were filled with gloves. He just, he swapped those out. He never wore 'em again for the rest of the trip. It was hilarious. And I'm like, dude, I'm sorry I didn't tell you about the cactus. I really did assume it was like a no-brainer. I don't crawl around places out here cause I'm afraid of the rattlesnakes.
Yeah. When you're looking for rattlesnakes, you just happen to notice the cactus. Yeah. I I always say [00:53:00] I wanna just buy knee pads every single year before we go out there, but then I end up coming and going and not buying knee pads. But I should because yeah, there's nothing worse than getting 'em in your palms or your knees just Yeah.
Crawling around even when you know they're there and you're trying to avoid 'em. But you're still gonna get some. But I would say knee pads aren't a terrible idea either. We've been wearing the we are big fans of Sitka in our family. And so we've been, we just keep the knee pads in them. Yeah.
Yeah. I say it's, you hunt two hours and you don't even notice those, and they don't wrap around your leg like a floor. It's only in the front where you need 'em. Yeah. But you also they stay in position always because they're sewn in. You can pull 'em out if you want. It's not easy. You have to flip your pants inside out, but they're always gonna be in the right spot.
And they're not like tied around your legs like a flooring knee pad where like soon they get loose and they're falling down and you're constantly adjusting them and they make noise like they are so seamlessly integrated to the pant that you'll, we will hunt for two hours and you never notice 'em again.
Yeah. So yeah, I would recommend that then because there's [00:54:00] ti I always say I want it, wanna get some but don't, because yeah, that's the other thing is getting 'em in the freaking kneecaps and hard to get out spots too. But yeah, no, it's it's even when you know they're there that you're still going, you're still gonna get some in the hands and knees.
So yeah, I'd say that'd be a great investment to get yeah. Yeah, for sure. So South Dakota sounds like it used to be a pretty good state for non-residents now getting a little trickier. Probably just have to be on the ball. These first couple years you probably still drop with zero points cuz no one's got points.
Yep. But then it's gonna start to dwindle back. So what would be like your, what would be like your state, what would be your lineup if someone's Hey, I think I'm gonna do like Logan and his dad and mum being punter. I want to go every year. What are like the three states you would focus on for a non-resident?
I would say Wyoming, number one. Just, I think that's in terms of draw statistics best don't quote me on that, but I'm pretty sure, Hector's more anal than people in Wyoming. That's a pretty good start. I dunno about after this light is blizzard that might have, knocked [00:55:00] this numbers down a little bit in terms of I mean they've, not that it's all for size because we love antelope tastes pretty dang and good too.
But definitely by far the most boon and kraken entries and Pope Young entries. I is Wyoming. I would say Wyoming even though I've never hunted there. Driven by a down through it a lot. Ton of ones right there. I'd say my most well-known one is Montana, but even that one's starting to get harder to draw.
I said we've applied for two years and still haven't gotten that one. I'd say those two states. Hoof. Third one. Just because I have hunted South Dakota. I know. But granted also, I wouldn't say South Dakota has the numbers that like Wyoming, Colorado Montana has just on those flats, hear a lot more about that.
We only really have it in our western, whole western side of South Dakota has antelope, but you really gotta hit the western half in the western half. And so I'd say [00:56:00] pretty much any state around that touches Montana. I'd say really any state that touches Wyoming would would be a pretty good pretty good spot.
I wanna say Wyoming probably is your best chance just because of draw statistics. I know New Mexico, Arizona, they have less antelope, but they also have. I think way more big ones on a per animal basis, just because they don't get the harsh winters. And so granted it's, I don't think the, been reading some stuff about it and that they do get bigger ones.
And you see the, usually the biggest one every year is shot down in one of those two states. Just because they live longer, there's less of 'em you're not gonna see. I'd say if you just want, if you're going spot in stock and you just want to see a lot of antelope, I'd say go to Wyoming or Montana just because they have the highest density numbers I would think.
But if you're trying to go after an absolute giant, I'd say the farther south you go. The better chance of that you have. But I'd say for a [00:57:00] do-it-yourselfer, first time I wanna go antelope, Huntington, I'd say Wyoming's your best bet. Best bet to get a tag the easiest, and just see and cheer numbers.
You're gonna, you're gonna see, you're gonna see a lot of goats out in Montana, Wyoming area. Yeah. Yeah. That's what we've seen driving through those states For other hunts, it's like you, we've tried to see how long we can go in Wyoming. Like, how many miles can we drive with eyes on a lop? Yeah. Oh, there's one.
All right. Got another one. Just leapfrogging and you can make it damn near across the entire state. Yeah. And I said, once you've, once you've seen a decent amount of goats, they just stick out like a sore thumb. Sometimes you're hiding a plate sight. You're like, how the heck do you not see?
But that white butt and whatnot is just, It's once you've ran your eyes across enough antelope, I mean they, they just stick out like sore thumbs most of the time. Yeah, that's the thing. It's way different than deer hunting in the sense that if you're out west deer hunting like mule deer hunting, the hardest thing I'd say sometimes on spot in stock is actually finding one, if they're betting some fixed stuff and they're tough.
The hard part about [00:58:00] antelope archery, antelope hunting is not the spotting part that's gonna be easy. It's the it's actual stock part is gonna be more challenging. It's more of a stock and stock, not apac. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Spottings gonna be easy. It's just gonna be the, is the stock that's gonna be hard.
So one thing I've noticed with the antelope and I'm by no means an antelope expert, but I have noticed when I'm out west doing other activities, other extracurriculars, the nastier the weather is the more I find antelope bed. On the top third of Ahi. And I'm like looking at those things like, man, that would be an easy stock right now, but I'm out tracing elk or meal deer.
But it seems like when you get like a cold, nasty, windy, rainy day, those antelope they're so weird because like you said, they don't bed down they're just out grazing all day long. It's like the Savannah elk meal, deer, whitetails, everything else. It's like evenings and mornings except for the rut.
But the antelope are just out all the time. But like it's almost the [00:59:00] opposite, like when you get that cold weather that makes you excited to go whitetail hunting and the rut, that's the weather that just shuts those antelope down. And maybe it's just a theory of mine, someone will have to test it out.
But I feel like spotting in stock with a bow might be a lot more successful on the nastiest weather you can find. Cuz those antelope will probably just bet up out of the wind somewhere. I would say the two windiest days we've had in Montana when we've spot in the stock, you're exactly right. And we've had, I've killed two that were be, cause like I said, usually even if they're, even if you see one bedding by the time that you loop around, because Yeah, even if you're a mile away and they see you walk somewhere, they're gonna get up.
So if you, by the time you loop around, they're not gonna be bed anymore, except in those super windy. My two best stocks, two of my best stocks ever were on absolutely like 40 mile an hour wind days. Except the only bad part about it when it's, they're bed halfway down in a bowl or whatnot, and you're on the top of the bowl in the 40 mile an hour wind, it's, you're 80 trying to hold you.
Yeah. You're trying to hold your [01:00:00] bow steady and you're like, holy cow. But you're exactly right. Literally I, my, I'm picturing two stocks in my head that we were able to get on antelope that actually stayed beded for long enough for us to get around. It's just the actual shooting part was the hardest because yeah, you're getting your bow's getting blown around so much at the top of the hill, or like a cold, dreary, rainy day that just like when it drops 30 degrees below normal.
And those I feel like from what I've seen, those antelope just really they yard up bed up and then they'll stay put long enough for you to get a stock in and then you just gotta play the cards, right? You just gotta be quiet, you gotta be stealthy, you gotta pick a right, the right path, but you should be.
You should get into the zone. Yes. I'd say one kind of a random tidbit here too is that since antelope can run like 65 miles an hour, they got some of the densest bones. I think in, again, don't quote me, but I think it's the densest bones in a North American land mammal. So with that, in terms of when you're shooting with [01:01:00] archery, you do not want to shoot in their front shoulder.
You'd rather gut shoot an antelope and you'd rather shoot back than front because we've had, we've heard countless stories that, even at 20, 30 yards, somebody shoots an antelope in the front shoulder and it doesn't even penetrate half the broadhead. And they just run off and nothing like, nothing hurt, hit 'em.
So I would say that's the one thing about antelope too, is that I would always wanna aim or hit back then forward because it's just their should. Their front shoulders can. Can take a lot when you're archery hunting 'em. So rifle's a whole nother story, but I mean they're, we've heard some horror stories about you hitting 'em in the front shoulder and it's just not going through.
Do you find a big tidbit for anyone coming from like Midwest shooting whitetails and dropping, like that's a huge issue with doze and stuff. Do you find that a lot of the antelope, you guys shoot at duck an arrow or drop or do they pretty much hold steady? I would say if you're water holding 'em, they know[01:02:00] that's one of their most vulnerable spots.
So they're jittery when they're coming into water. And so usually when we're water hole hunting 'em, you really want to make sure they're coming in and usually right when they're getting a drink of water, they get one of their legs out front a little bit more like into the water. And when they drop their head and when they put their head down, that's when you wanna shoot and when they're gonna be most, but I'd say I have had some duck, the arrow still hit, but.
Jump the string when they're in the water hole, usually on spot and stocks. It's different and just the sound of it isn't gonna make 'em jump. But I'd say they're a lot more jittery if they're if you're water hole hunting 'em than if they are at spot and stock. Another thing I should mention is that if you are water hole hunting 'em, for instance, I don't really think you could go put up a ground blind and hunt a whitetail that same day with a ground blind that just popped up outta nowhere.
Yeah. Archery, cuz they, they know, realize that and are gonna be leery. [01:03:00] Antelope aren't that way. They trust their eyes so much that even if you pop up a blind, if you say you're driving out west, you only have, first day is only a half day, you think you see a good water hole and you want to, don't be afraid to even hunt just a half day or pop that up and just sit right away because.
Antelope will come in right away, even if you set up a blind. Cause they trust their eyes so much. And it's different than when you're whitetail hunting or something else because I've never seen a whitetail, you pop a blind up and they're walking within 30 yards an hour later, but an antelope will they're weird like that, that they, you'd be able to do that too, but I'd say yeah, jumping strings a little bit in water hole just because they know that's when they're their most vulnerable.
Vulnerable. And another thing is, I just say it's got a perfect aim spot, right? Where that right where they're they got gray in their front shoulder and on their back and then white on their belly, but it really comes, you really wanna just hit aim right where the grain white meat right at that corner of the box.
That's about perfect aiming point you are. So they really give you [01:04:00] a. Aim here, sign in terms of right where the, yeah. Brown and white meet. So if you're wondering to know where to hit 'em, that's where to hit 'em. And another good thing is, them being able to run 60 miles an hour and whatnot, they're, they have huge lungs.
On a long, on a animal size. You're gutting them. They're long, might not be bigger than a whitetail, but you also gotta remember they're a lot smaller than a whitetail. Yeah, lung to body size is a heck, you got a heck of a lot more chance to hit a lung on an antelope than you do a deer just for your whole lung to body size.
Actually, I've heard if you put it, I've heard people say if you put it between the goalpost, you'll get 'em. If you put exactly, and you put it between the legs, you'll get 'em just Exactly. And and it's true. It's like they will die. They might run a long ways, but you're in the Sahara, so you, maybe you can watch 'em run for 400 yards and tip over.
And again, they're white so they stick out. But I would say exactly that antelope are tough. But at the same time, if you hit 'em between the goalposts. Usually you'll get one more opportunity even if you hit a bad shot and you hit far back, hit liver, hit guts. They usually, they'll give [01:05:00] you one easy layup shot in terms of they'll run off you gut shoot it bed down.
And usually it's a, in my experience, not that I gut shot a lot or but even if you liver shot, my dad's had my dad's had thir go on 13 for 13. He's had two or three not so great hits on 'em the first time cuz they're jittery a little bit more over water. But they usually give you a really good follow up shot that first time.
But after that first follow shot and if you don't capitalize on that, then they get adrenaline pumping and then, I mean they could run for miles. But yeah, I would say if you hit 'em between the goalposts, you're exactly right. Just make sure it's between the goalposts. Cause if you hit. Left goalpost.
If it's the front shoulders, it might probably just donk off of 'em. So you don't wanna be in that situation. Are you shooting big mechanicals? I feel like antelopes of an animal that was made for a big expandable broadhead. I shoot ma ManTech G three s. Antelope have, so [01:06:00] I don't wanna, so right when Rage first came out, they had a lot of problems.
Shooting antelope cuz antelope's hair is so hollow that it was really messing with the first, their second generation of rage broadheads that it was opening up too early because they have a lot, they just have weird hair. If you Okay. Harvest an antelope, pull a tough note. First of all, the hair falls out, fall out.
They got, it's like they're on chemo. Yeah, exactly. If you drag an antelope a hundred yards, cuz that's how far you gotta drag into the cart. Wherever you drag it. Either headquarter, the butt will have no hair. It's fallen off. It's not like a deer. It's really hollow. And so that was messing with the expandables.
Okay. But I will say that was right when rage first came out. But since then, my dad shoots expandables. Adam Ha hasn't had any problems. But I know if you somehow are a early generation, haven't gotten new broadheads in a long time, you might have some problems. But I shoot ManTech and I [01:07:00] forgot what my dad shoots, but he shoots expandables and hasn't had any problem.
But yeah, you wanna, you put a good hole in 'em. Yeah, you're, yeah, exactly. They're you put it between the goalpost, it'll go down. There you go. I feel like we've given the listeners a pretty good crash course in the archery antelope. The things they need to know. Thanks for coming on Logan.
Like I said, it's nice to have a buddy that's been doing it for 13 years cuz I've only shot one and it was with a 300 win meg, so not really relevant to today's conversation. But yeah, thanks for being here is a great to hear some more about Archery antelope. Hopefully the listeners that are interested got some valuable tips and tricks and are ready to hit the western front range, this coming fallen.
Try to stick an antelope. Yeah, I'd say it's definitely worth worth doing once. Just something different. You, no, usually nobody else has anything going on in middle of August. Get out ahead, start your season early one year and head out west and try your luck at a speed goat.
Awesome. I might have to tag along with you one of these archery over the counter hunts [01:08:00] that you got. Yeah, see it'll be kind, fun to do, awesome. Cool. Yeah. Thanks for being here Logan, and thanks for listening folks.