Wild Game Cooking

On this episode of The Western Rookie Podcast, Brian talks with Jaime Teigen about what happens after the hunt in the kitchen!

Jaime is a master chef who specialized in wild game. Jaime is the host of her very own Outdoor Class series about cooking western game. Brian and Jaime talk about field care for wild game, weather considerations, and how to get your meat cooled down as fast as possible before diving into different recipes, unique cuts that most people overlook, and why there aren’t as many wild game appetizer cookbooks as there should be! Click the links below to check out Jaime’s page and get 20% the Outdoor Class series with code “JAIME”!

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Welcome back to another Western Rookie Podcast episode. I'm your host, Brian Krebs. And tonight I have Jamie Tagan on the call. And Jamie, if you don't know, has been I would say you've racked up more cooking experience than most people probably have in their life. And that's saying something because we're both pretty young, and so we thought it would be a good time to [00:01:00] have you on the podcast right before season and help people think about what they can do with their animals to make the best meals once they get home.

Jamie Teigen: Absolutely, yeah. I appreciate you calling me young, but yeah. I've been a chef since 2002, and really... Just love wild game cooking so much. And it's fun to experience it with others. My husband, family and stuff like that. And. It's just a great time and especially now we're like people are thinking about What do I do with the stuff in the freezer right now?

Brian Krebs: Hopefully people have that a lot of people I've been talking to have been at the point where they're like Should I unplug my freezer? There's nothing in it anymore because I'm out and we're getting close to season again That's awesome. Yeah, but no, I'm at that point where I've had a couple of really good years and we've been doing a lot more dough management here in Minnesota and so I'm trying to cycle through as much as I can because we leave and by the time this airs we will be [00:02:00] in Colorado Elk Hunting.

In September, but as we, August 24th. So it's two and a half weeks. We're going to be hitting the road, hopefully we shoot eight bulls. That would be amazing. We'll probably be lucky to get one, but if we did get eight, I'm like, I don't think I have freezer room for an entire elk right now.

You're like,

Jamie Teigen: please, take it.

Brian Krebs: Oh yeah, but you can never do that because it's so good. It's delicious.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, I know. Just buy another

Brian Krebs: freezer. I've done that twice. I have I don't know what everyone else's system is. You probably have a great system. But my system is I have an upright freezer, a sole freezer, not a combo.

And I put a lot of my finished, individually packaged things on the shelves. And then I have a big chest freezer. It's probably like a 21 cubic foot. And I found that when you get like an extra large milk crate, those plastic milk crates, you can get them, typically they're square, but you can get the rectangle version and they fit perfectly sideways.

And I can stack two up three wide. So I have six milk crates and I'll [00:03:00] put a different. Type of meat or game in each one. So I have the blue one is fish because it reminds me of water they're all color coded I don't remember any of the other colors except the fish one But I'll put like pork and trimmings in one for making sausage in and make I'll do a lot of whole bone cuts on white tails, especially like I don't really like to trim out the shanks anymore And so I'll put those all, I'll wrap those and put those in one.

And that way I can actually lift one out and get at the bottom of my chest freezer. That's a great idea. Yeah. I just stumbled across it on accident. I've never seen anyone else do it. You probably have to make sure, yeah, you might have to make sure you have the right freezer for it, but mine just, I got lucky.

I can, they fit like within an inch of perfect in every dimension. And then I have some room on top. So that's the overflow I can stack. I have a couple things on top and then I have a little side pouch where I keep like ice jugs. That's great. That's really great. But I still need to [00:04:00] get through them all and start making some stuff.

And maybe after this conversation I'll just be all fired up and I'll run out and pull some things out and fire up the pellet grill and start cooking again.

Jamie Teigen: That's awesome. We have a tendency to so we do a lot of small batch stuff, so we don't, like when we process an animal, we're not processing.

It all at once like I'll leave a front shoulder or a hind quarter Just for later if I want to try something new with a grind or you know a cut or something like that So I have legs in our freezer

Brian Krebs: To be fair I do too. I went through a phase of efficiency and so I was shooting, here in Minnesota we can shoot two white tailed does during the regular deer season and you can use any weapon that's open.

But then we have an early antlerless season as well that allows you to shoot three additional does it's only on one weekend Oh, and then we get our any [00:05:00] deer which is typically your buck license But you could shoot another doe with that one And so I've been you know We've been solely off of beef for a long time and me and my wife because we're just we don't have kids and we shoot enough And so we've been doing that.

When I travel two hours to the farm to hunt on a weekend And I shoot two deer, and then I gotta get them taken care of, butchered in the cooler, and hit the road again on Sunday night for work on Monday. I started realizing I don't have time to trim out any of these shanks, and so I cut the shank off, and just wrap it.

And then I got to the point where I'm like these front shoulders on a doe, like a yearling doe especially there's not a lot there. So I started wrapping those whole... And I tried I've tried a couple different methods, the latest one I've tried is I'll put it on the pellet grill for a couple hours and try to build a little bit of a bark, and I don't try to go too long cause there's just not enough moisture in that meat to do like a brisket cook, but then I'll wrap it and add a little moisture and basically, the goal is to [00:06:00] basically kind of pressure cook it or be able to shred it, And use that for either barbacoa I tried to do some, I tried to copy the Chipotle barbacoa recipe because we love that.

And I didn't quite get it. It's very good, but it's not the same as theirs or just taco meat, like shredded taco meat, and then I use that for my meal preps every week.

Jamie Teigen: Oh, that's awesome. Yeah. We, so my first backcountry hunters and anglers rendezvous in Missoula a few years ago. We, Randy actually gave us my friend and I, Corey, a wolf hindquarter and there's no fat on those.

So we smoked it, but what we did was we put bear fat on it and then wrapped it, that turned out so good because they're super lean, just like a young fawn or, like a yearling or deer, whatever. There's no [00:07:00] fat. Of course, you're not going to get any moisture to really for it to shred apart.

But we added that bear fat. It was so good.

Brian Krebs: That's good. Really good. I assume with a wolf, like any carnivore, you have, you really have to get it up to that 160, 165. Yes.

Jamie Teigen: Yep. Yep. But it just shredded off. That fat just really helped. And, of course, wrapping it properly, too, just really.

Soaked up that goodness and moisture and it was not dry at all. It was pretty

Brian Krebs: tasty. Yeah, that would be tasty. I had a coworker once. And so that we're in Minnesota, North Dakota, by mind you. So we weren't bringing in Sharon Wolfe's, but he shot a coyote. And he was a DIY home chef, like not in any type of professional or trained capacity, but just loved to cook and was known for it.

And so he brought in coyote sausage, like breakfast sausage, and he just showed up at my desk with a warm [00:08:00] sausage on a, like an individual paper plate. And he's Hey Brian, you should try this. And what we know, like I, he knows I love to hunt. I know he likes to cook. And so I think he just assumed I would be interested and I'm like I don't know how you got this coyote.

I don't know what you did to prepare the meat. I don't know how you cooked it I'm like, I suppose and I ate it and it was fine It you could tell it wasn't a deer or a pig but i'm I looked at him like I really hope you know about trichinosis

Oh, that's too funny. And it was five years ago and I'm still alive, so I survived. So he did something right. He did something right. I would not make a practice of probably saving the meat on a coyote. Yeah, I think there was a lot of pork and seasoning in that mix. Mostly pork. Yeah. One coyote. I made 25 pounds of pork sausage.

It's 25 to one, [00:09:00] but but yeah, so with the season coming along I thought it was a good idea. There's one question that me and my elk hunting group go back and forth with all the time. So we archery hunt, it's usually. It's usually warmer than you'd like to keep meat out. It can get cool at night. So what is the, what would someone.

Want to keep in mind if they shoot an arch, an animal in archery season, just say archery season in general, where the daytime temperature is definitely above a fridge temp. Yeah. Maybe the nighttime can cool off, obviously shade's a big part of it, but how long can someone keep a quarter hung in a bag that has airflow, like a true proper game bag, before they need to start thinking like, we need to make a trip into town, we need to find a butcher, we need to get this thing in some type of a cooler environment.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, so you so when we, so I don't archery hunt, my husband does but [00:10:00] when he, if he gets something this time of year we usually like to hang our animals, but we don't let the temperature like in our garage or even outside. We don't let it get really below or above, like that 49 to 50 degrees.

Okay. Okay. So if it's anything above that, we're like on ice in the cooler making sure that it is, because you don't want any of that meat to go rotten. We had a deer actually my friend's bear he kept it out too long and it got over 52 degrees outside and the meat was completely ruined. And just a sad, like super sad, we ourselves, when like my husband got his bear, his spring bear, he came off the mountain right away. Okay. And that's hot, he came off the mountain right away, because we're like, we're not gonna, we're not gonna spoil this meat, get it on ice as fast as you can.

Just antelope, it's super... And it can be [00:11:00] very sensitive with antelope, you have to get it to a really cool temperature really quick, or you're going to taste that, taste that, sage or whatever, pretty quickly because it's a sensitive animal, but I feel like elk are pretty stout you can keep them a little longer, but anything over that 49 to 50 degrees, I'd say, you need to get it on

Brian Krebs: something.

You want to keep it below that. Yeah, so if you shoot one in some side of a backcountry scenario, where it's going to be like multiple days before we can get out of here with backpacking. So you do all the tricks, hang it up, get air flow. You don't want to seal it off in like a garbage bag.

No, that's terrible. If there's like a cold creek get some coldness on it. But is there like a, that I would actually, I might have to rethink what I was thinking. Cause originally I was thinking like, Oh, even in archery season, if you put it in the shade and it cools down to 30 degrees at night, [00:12:00] you can make it multiple days.

But now I'm wondering if I need to be like, eh, we shot at this at the beginning of the hunt. We should bring it down to town right off the bat to try to get this in a cooler.

Jamie Teigen: I get what you mean. I like having me sit out is It's really scary to me if you, especially if it's if you don't know what the temperature is going to be, but if you have an idea, just prepare.

Okay. If you have a creek. Put it in the creek, but you don't want that. You also don't want that water flowing over the meat

Brian Krebs: either, right? You have to get it propped up over the water, but getting that cool airflow.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah. Yeah So I mean once it gets down to the temperatures that you can just let it hang and age a little bit that's perfectly fine.

But in these Temperatures that, in the fall that can be up and down,

Brian Krebs: just prepare ahead of time. That's why we typically have now been bringing chest freezers with us and generators. But then, we've always had every year, we've [00:13:00] had an issue. Like the generator doesn't like to run at altitude or the chest freezer's not working because we just rattled it down a mountain road for five miles.

And typically, if

Jamie Teigen: we're not... And dry ice. If you take dry ice and wrap it, usually it'll last you a couple days for sure. Like we

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So

Jamie Teigen: we do like multi-day rafting trips. Okay. And we're taking meat on these trips and so what we've done is either put our cooler in a freezer or [00:15:00] take. Like just really cold water and just like essentially freeze our coolers or take dry ice wrap it and then put Bubble wrap on top of it.

So it acts as an insulator Oh, yeah, and that'll actually make it last longer Interesting, so that'll buy you a couple days With that dry ice, because if you don't wrap it, it'll only last 24 hours and the dry ice is going to be gone. But wrapping it and putting an insulator of that bubble wrap, it'll buy you time.

And it'll last us, we're on the river for six days. And it'll last us five to six

Brian Krebs: days, for sure. Okay, interesting.

Jamie Teigen: That could be an option too, because then you're, with the dry ice, you're keeping your coolers, like the whole inside outside. To temp as well.

Brian Krebs: Oh yeah. I think it would be, I think a lot of people, myself included, would probably be surprised if we knew what the temperature of the inside of a rear quarter really is.[00:16:00]

And we never bring a thermometer. Maybe we should throw that in the camp kit. You touch the outside and you're like, oh, that feels cold. We should be good. But you especially when they're like in the I don't know, decades ago when, before everyone knew you had to get the hide off of an elk right away.

It's yeah they spoil from the femur bone out, not from the outside in. And because they're 104 degrees when they are on the hoof. And if you don't take that hide off, it stays that warm for a long time, even though it's winter and it's snowy out. Yeah. So maybe that's the thing to do is just bring one of those inst, like those old not even a digital, but just an old like turkey fryer, you'd have to get the right temp range, but just put it in and be able to be like, Oh boy, we got to go to town.

Yes.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah. And they have those instant readers. Those things aren't going to run out of battery on you, and they fit right in your pocket. It's, that's an easy thing to put in your pack if you need it to or at camp. I

Brian Krebs: actually won one of those at our White Elephant Christmas last year, so I should just throw that in.

Yeah, the little one that [00:17:00] folds like a little pencil. And it's actually long enough, too, to get into the middle of an Elkhorn. Yeah. That's a good idea. Now, I gave you a, I gave you a little life hack, now I got one in return, so we're off to a good start.

Jamie Teigen: I love it.

Brian Krebs: Yeah, so once we get the meat cool and I liked how you mentioned the antelope you didn't do it for the listeners, but you did the, they taste like sage in quotes.

Does that mean it's not actually sage that you're tasting?

Jamie Teigen: A lot of people don't like antelope because, you find antelope out in sage land, prairie land, just a lot of random grasses, and a lot of people, if you don't process antelope correctly, You're going to taste that because it's a sensitive meat.

And and like to us, because we process it like literally right away, we don't get any of that. Like antelope is probably, it's literally my number one. I absolutely love it. I've never had [00:18:00] antelope that is bad, but I just know how to take care of it. We get our antelope and we're like headed home, so right.

Brian Krebs: I, yeah, I've always hunted them.

Jamie Teigen: It's just

Brian Krebs: so good. Yeah. I've always hunted them with a cooler full of ice and I always leave it, the ice in the bags. So that way when I shoot an antelope, I've only done this once on my own, but my brother does it a lot. Where he'll have his freezer plugged in running and froze.

So when he gets an antelope, it goes right into the freezer. But that way you can lift the whole bag of ice up and put your antelope on the bottom and then put it down. Cause if you take all the ice out, you can get more in it, but then you can't get into it to get. And then when you scoop it out, you lose all your ice.

Cause it's now in the truck bed and it just becomes a mess. So yeah, I've always, we've always hunted with a cold freezer or a cold cooler for antelope. And we love it too. I think we'd say the same thing. It's some of our favorite like antelope steaks. Delicious.

Jamie Teigen: Oh, good. You can't go wrong. It's, everybody asks, what's your favorite wild game to cook?

And it's hands down [00:19:00] antelope. It's just my favorite. Absolutely favorite.

Brian Krebs: Are there any animals that you do not get excited thinking about cooking them?

Jamie Teigen: We cook a lot of, all wild game is really good. It's more of tasting different things. Okay. That some of them make me cringe and some of them don't.

I've had a lot of weird things to eat. But I get excited about cooking all wild game and just seeing okay, what can I do something that's Personal to me to make it different than a different chef has done. And making my kind of niche on that one dish or, something like that, or being able to use multiple game wild game and the same dish, and it would taste just as good.

If that makes any sense, but I like it all. I think it's just. If somebody gives me, something random to cook, I'm like, heck yeah! My father in law, [00:20:00] he we went paddle fishing this year, and he brought me a beaver hindquarter. A beaver? Yeah. And I'm like, okay! Let's do it!

Brian Krebs: I have a, for some reason I feel like I heard that beaver tail used to be a delicacy back when the trapping era was around because of all the fat in the tail, and, being in the...

Basically, woodsmen and bushcrafters, they didn't have a lot of fats, and so they would the beaver tail was considered a delicacy.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, I've never cooked beaver tail. I've never eaten it either. I would love to someday.

Brian Krebs: We'll have to catch one. But, I want to taste it.

Jamie Teigen: But,

Brian Krebs: Yeah, the reason I ask about the animals that aren't as fun to cook is because I've heard so many different I would say conspiracy theories on which animals taste bad, and then someone, as soon as I'll hear that, the next podcast guest will be like, I love that animal.

Something as simple as bears. Somebody will say ah, I didn't really the taste of a bear, and then the next person says, I love spring bear, like you get, and so I, [00:21:00] and especially with the sheep and goats, I hear a lot of controversy on people thinking it tastes horrible, and then the next person's no, I thought it tasted great, like obviously you gotta cook it but it turned out really well.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, I know. An old goat and an old sheep are going to taste way different than a younger one, just like any other animal but again, it's like how you learn how to cook it too. There are meats that you just literally have to, Cook the heck out of for hours, and in order for it to like actually break down and, be edible.

But have you, so we're dabbling in like canning meat. Yeah. Yum. We're totally obsessed. So

Brian Krebs: I'm really intrigued by the idea because it would allow me to take meat, get it into a good serving size because we do a lot of meal prep. Me and my wife do a lot of meal prep. And so we'll cook one day a week.

We, we cook anywhere from eight to we've been doing as much as like 28 meals. If we're doing two a day for seven days. [00:22:00] So it really can add up and so it's I don't really want to really, I don't want to cook 10 pounds of taco meat at once because that doesn't fit in a pan and now you're doing multiple, batches of taco meat on a Sunday and it turns into an all day adventure, whereas the canning, if I'm understanding it correctly you, it goes in and when it's, you can store it at room temperature in a darker environment and you can pull it out and like

Jamie Teigen: a pantry.

Yep.

Brian Krebs: Yeah. So it is, it's cooked going in, right? Or does it cure while it's in? Yeah, so

Jamie Teigen: You, so you put it in raw. And then you literally, you don't put any any like juice in it or anything. No broth and then a simple seasoning. You can it just as you would, like we have a pressure cooker that we put it in.

And we used let's see, like quart size jars. Okay,

Brian Krebs: so the bigger mason

Jamie Teigen: jar. The bigger mason jars, yeah. And and then that cooks in about 80 minutes. For it to come to temperature and then, [00:23:00] yeah, you just store it like you would pickles or whatever and we do the court. There's only three of us in our family and we do the court size and it's great for one meal.

It feeds all of us. You can eat it cold. It's just as good cold, but it's like a quick, easy meal that you can heat up real quick and sandwiches tacos. Whatever you want. We do a lot of yeah. Put it on mashed potatoes or rice or whatever with a simple gravy or something, and it's like really quick.

It takes literally minutes to heat up, so we really like it. But yeah, you just store it like any can. Yeah,

Brian Krebs: or whatever. We're going to be planning a garden next year because we have the room to plant a garden finally. Yeah, and so my wife is super excited about it. And so we moved in halfway through the year and the garden just had weeds and so I took the fence down.

I mowed it. We're gonna get the tractor and we, and turn it over and everything. But she's already looking at one of our pastures because it used to be a horse [00:24:00] facility. And so she's already looking at one of the pastures and she's What if we move the garden over there and use that entire pasture for the...

Keep in mind, these are like half acre pastures, but still a half acre garden is a lot of garden. That is

Jamie Teigen: a lot. That's awesome. It's sad. I can't grow a thing. And as a chef, that's terrible. I have tried and tried and I. I can't grow anything. And my parents are incredible gardeners, like they can literally put something in a little dish and it'll grow.

I can't grow anything, so I have lots of friends that give me things. You

Brian Krebs: probably, it's just like everyone's got a strength and yours is just like in the kitchen. So it's you guys grow it for me and then bring it over to the kitchen and we'll take it from there. I'm gonna take over there, yep. But yeah, that's a nice 'cause, we'll, not my thing. We'll probably have to start canning once we start getting this massive garden producing and we can't handle all this. You're

Jamie Teigen: gonna have to build a new pantry, .

Brian Krebs: We yeah, we might, we have a big utility room downstairs with lots of [00:25:00] shelving, so I think that's gonna be the start.

And if that runs out, then we will have to start adding different rooms. We got lucky with a pretty big house and we don't have kids yet, so there's plenty of space to start storing stuff. I can see it now. Yep. I would love to raise some of my own chickens and... Pork, but we have compromised and not gonna do that based on the smell and the noises

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, we tried chickens we actually lived in North Dakota for a while.

Oh and we tried chickens and they were meat chickens and I will tell you right now that I will never do chickens again

Brian Krebs: Not a fun experience

Jamie Teigen: Not a fun experience. I mean they were really sweet, but they were just tough the, how fast they grow. Is really astonishing and yeah, it just grosses you out [00:26:00] really.

And you're like, this is just not normal. And so I'm done

Brian Krebs: with it. Yeah. I have coworkers

Jamie Teigen: that do it. Like chickens are way different. I think, anybody who raises chickens for eggs is totally awesome. And they become part of your family, but meat chickens. I'll stay away from that.

Brian Krebs: My issues, I don't know what to do with the egg chicken in the wintertime.

Cause we have we can get two, three feet of standing snow pretty easy here in Minnesota, but we have a 500 square foot chicken coop right out back that the farm came with. So we have everything we need. We have some horse stalls, but I don't know I just have to do the research and be like, am I supposed to bring these into the horse stalls all winter long and winter them inside?

Or do they still stay out in the chicken coop and just put up with the snow? How does all this work?

Jamie Teigen: They'll probably really love your horse

Brian Krebs: stalls. Yeah. That's what I think the previous owners did. But then I got to walk all the way out there to get my eggs every morning. And that can be pretty cold some days.

In

Jamie Teigen: Minnesota and in North Dakota, [00:27:00] yes. Yeah.

Brian Krebs: It's just as cold as North Dakota, except North Dakota probably gets a little bit worse because of all the wind. I used to live in North Dakota as well. Yeah. Yeah. Those winters were brutal. I don't know. I'd be like, ah, maybe I'm going to have pancakes today instead of eggs.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah. I'm glad I'm in Montana now. I'm certainly I don't miss those North Dakota winters.

Brian Krebs: Yeah, it's been nice just getting out of the wind, to be honest. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, one thing that I wanted to ask you, I've been saving this question. for weeks to ask because I think a lot of people get into the rut, if you will, of when we get an animal, we do this with each cut, the back straps we cut up for steaks, the tenderloins, we maybe cook those while we're butchering it, if you have a deer camp style tradition, and then I know a lot of people that I talk to about butchering, the rest pretty much goes to grind.

A lot of times, and sometimes they turn that into, [00:28:00] brats, or they bring it in and get something made from it, but a lot of people, I feel like, underutilize a lot of cuts on an animal, and so if we just talk, for example, of a deer or an elk, something that's pretty familiar with most people, what are some of your different cuts, or things to do with different cuts that you think are like, very much underrated, like a sleeper recipe for some of these cuts that would probably end up in the grind pile?

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, so I know this is an organ, but we save all of our hearts. I feel like heart is super underrated. Okay. Just because you can really do anything you want with it. If you were to do a steak or tacos or anything like that. And it's just really good and tender. I think it scares a lot of people to cook the heart because it is intimidating.

You see this thing and it's oh, what's this white stuff around it? It's tough, you have to work around the arteries and stuff like that but really one once you like [00:29:00] figure out the science of it and how to break down a heart and you get these two to three really great steaks where you can just season like you would any other steak.

It's really good to try. You can do tartars with it and regular steak, tacos or whatever. So you can really do anything with a heart that you can with a regular steak. Another thing too is like you think of tri tip and beef. Deer and elk also have tri tip.

And it's become a really popular cut of meat. Obviously it's going to be much smaller than a cow or beef. But it's there. And then also a coulette, which is around where the tri tip is. And it's a smaller cut of meat as well, but it's great for stuffing it with things. And doing like a nice roast on it. And it's not very big either. But for one person for a night, it's like a great meal, okay. But, yeah, and usually a coulette is you would cut it into, they call it like a picana. You would do it like it, they do it in skewers [00:30:00] sometimes.

Oh, okay. And when you cook it rounds. Okay. You'll have to look it up. But so that's the same thing, but. I think those are like my three that people just throw away cause they're smaller. And don't really understand what it is.

Brian Krebs: So I think one thing that changed, mostly changed how I butcher a deer or an elk is understanding all of the different muscle groups in the rear quarter and how there's so many different things going on where growing up deer camp, it was like everybody butchered on Sunday and it was just cut everything into baseball sized pieces and put it in the grinder. And so you'd take like a big scoop out of that rear quarter. Cause you get like a, you can get a pretty big chunk of meat without a bone in it. Yeah, like you're really just cross cutting all of these different cuts and like I think I don't know maybe it's just me not understanding the different cuts that a butcher knows But it's like pretty much all of the rest of the steaks other than like the ribeyes and the strip [00:31:00] are in the rear quarter All of your different sirloins and your round steaks are all in the rear corner.

I figured, I don't know where, I guess if you had asked me when I was 15, where all those steaks were, I'd be like, I don't know, just different portions of the backstrap, probably.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah. In my belly.

Brian Krebs: Yeah. They they're not here anymore. That's where they're at. Yeah.

Jamie Teigen: And I think, yeah and we're like, when we process animals, we are very careful and we, we like set every piece out, like, all right, we don't have a whole lot of grind.

To be honest, just because if there is fat on it, use it and, use it, grill it up, don't cut it all off because a lot of these animals, in, in rut season, they're not going to have a ton of fat. The does are, especially in later, winter, if you're able to get like a winter, but hunt, you can have some of that fat and render it down or keep it on the meat.

But I don't know. It's. [00:32:00] I feel like I don't know. We've like just really taken the time to get to know each part. And the parts that are small really do grow in the grind. And that's where we do a lot of small batch type stuff, because we want to try new things. And, maybe those parts, those pieces that go in the grind, cut them up small, and that is the canning, instead of tossing it into a grind.

Brian Krebs: Yeah, one thing that I struggle with is we, you, my wife loves ground, she loves taco meat in her meal preps and I usually do a, I usually take the shanks and I will just slow roast them in the, in our big roaster until they get real tender and then I shred it, get rid of, some of that stuff doesn't, you don't want to eat, eat the fat for sure, but the, like the tendons when they turn to gelatin They don't taste that great.

A little bit of a

Jamie Teigen: weird texture. But you a, yeah, you could do that with a front shoulder too, to, just cause those don't have a ton of meat. If you have a smaller, [00:33:00] deer, break that

Brian Krebs: down. That's what I wanted to get. I originally thought the roaster would work good for that.

It, I learned that if I don't tie the front quarters together before I freeze them, they're too long to put in the roaster. So I gotta use butcher twine and tie them up so they freeze smaller. But yeah, that's what we do. But what I really would love is to experiment with, I would love to design like a flat, wide pressure cooker.

So instead of the can cooker that's like a deep thing you put small stuff in, I would want to do basically a big cookie sheet with a lid that you can seal up and pressure cook and then put like a full quarter like you said. On a pressure cooker throw in anything you want for seasoning and then throw that on the grill and basically pressure cook an entire quarter Down and shred it.

Yeah,

Jamie Teigen: that'd be awesome. I haven't found one because they're not but like even the instapots They're just not really big enough to put like a big piece of meat I

Brian Krebs: have you know, I have the rear shank on [00:34:00] my north dakota bowl I I had it, it's gone now, but I saved the shanks on that because I butchered that bull itself and it was a lot of meat.

The rear quarter weighed 82 pounds and it was, yeah, it was a bit, I think everyone says, Oh quarters are a hundred pounds, but they're really not. They're usually like 60 on a rag or a medium bowl. And this one was 82, but I trimmed out the entire recorder, but I kept the shank as a whole.

And I cooked that solo on the pellet grill, but when I had it in the freezer, it looked like Fred Flintstone's bat. It was like 10 pounds and it was like, the it was the length of my entire arm and on the end of it, it was like 6 inches no way more than that. It was like 8 inches across in diameter.

The thing was huge and there's no way you're going to fit that in an Instapot.

Jamie Teigen: No, no way. You'd have to like... Take a saw every six inches.

Brian Krebs: Yeah. You'd have to make batch like Asabuco. Yeah. you'd have to batch it because you couldn't fit them all in at once. And so that's where I was just wondering if you can make if somebody [00:35:00] could make like a bigger, wider, flatter pressure cooker that you'd put like basically the entire, like you'd probably take up your entire pellet grill or your entire oven.

But then you could start to slow cook some of these cuts that just to me It's not worth my time to try to butcher and Prep a front quarter on a dough to get all that meat when I can just slow cook it and all that meat falls off And I get it all anyway, I probably have more efficiency that way.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah. Yeah I mean I have those like 22 quart roasters, And you can pile those up with quite a bit of meat, but even like a small dough, you still have to bend it somehow to get it in there

Brian Krebs: to let it grow the whole thing. Yeah. You have to tie it up until it starts to get warm and soft and then it'll fit.

I usually, I, to be honest, I probably, I don't do it the right way. I usually throw 10 or 12 white tail shanks in my, I think it's a 22 quart roaster. Yeah, and I just throw them in frozen, to be honest with you. I just dump them in, fill it with water. I add [00:36:00] a lot of salt. I was told it's supposed to be like, almost a tablespoon per pound for bone in cuts.

And that's what I read. I just okay, tablespoon a pound. Yeah, I just run with it. And I'm like, I don't know, each one probably weighs a pound or more. So I did one and a half tablespoons per shank. So maybe it was way too salty. I don't know, but it definitely worked.

Jamie Teigen: Oh, that's great. It cooks all the same if it's frozen.

Brian Krebs: Yeah, it takes all day, which I should probably think ahead and do it when they're not frozen, but I would just love to batch it and do a big batch of taco meat, and I use those one quart mason jars, too, which works out, I could fit about two pounds of taco meat in a one quart mason jar, which you're like, oh, go figure, it's 32 ounces, and there's, 16 ounces in a pound, but it does work out to be two pounds, and that's about how much I've been eating a very lean carnivore diet, so I've been using about two pounds a day, and so I just, that's what I need.

Yeah.

Jamie Teigen: Yep, I have it all [00:37:00] measured out for you.

Brian Krebs: And if I could just get in the habit of doing that in the fall when I shoot the animals instead of putting those quarters in the freezer first and then having to thaw them out later and do all that meal prep, I'd be, I'd really be going places.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, we have I mentioned earlier that we do like small batches and stuff like that, but it's really been fun, we save legs and we try and harvest as many animals as possible just because of being a wild game chef. I use so much of it and I want to save those legs so I can have a specific cut for a recipe, and, stuff like that and be able to choose what I want. But it's fun just sharing that process experience with people that don't really understand it and want to learn about it too.

We've really enjoyed sharing that with some of our friends that are like new hunters this past year. Just so they can maybe figure out their own process that they want to do. And, I, they were always, they're always [00:38:00] asking me for recipes and stuff like that. But a couple of them are like meat eaters and fruit eaters, they eat a ton of meat and so their process may be much different than ours, and so it's fun to share those moments with people that are, new to you know feel to table processing, all of that thing all of that stuff. We really enjoy that

Brian Krebs: Do you get a special kick out of it when you serve like maybe you have guests over for dinner?

And you serve something and they're like, oh my gosh, this is delicious. What is it? And then you'll tell them It's, whatever wild game, and they're like, this is a wild game. And they're just they're shocked that you could possibly go out into nature and gather this yourself it's so good it has to be farm raised, right?

I find, like, when people say that, it's just yeah, it's wild game. It's... Yeah.

Jamie Teigen: My mother, hates wild game, but she grew up with a dad. That Didn't know how to cook it. Yeah, and so it was always overcooked or you know over a [00:39:00] season or something like that and so she Has literally been like I know that you guys hunt but I will not eat this but the last two years And I'm always like trying to like, Hey mom, just try this.

And she's like an overdone steak gal, which is fine. Everybody has their way of eating a steak or whatever. And so the last couple of years I'm like, mom, try this. It's just a little bite, but it's. And so she's finally coming around she's had duck this year. She's tried bear, she's tried all these things and she's okay, I think I can get behind this.

Brian Krebs: There you go. But

Jamie Teigen: those stuff like that I love seeing that, and people just being very surprised of really how good it can taste if it's cooked properly. And just teaching people too. With these outdoor classes, I love being able to like, have these courses of teaching people pretty [00:40:00] simple recipes, but how to cook it right.

And I love it when people come up to me and be like, okay, how do you do this? Or. What's an easy recipe for a family of, four to six or whatever, and, being able to share those I don't hide recipes I want to share everything, because I feel like it's really important that, if you harvest an animal, that you are doing everything that you can to contribute to the future.

1, we don't buy meat from the store and that's okay if everybody else does or however they do their shopping. We don't do that. But to show people like. Wild game for us is sustainable for our family, and it can't be for you to and so these are the steps that we take to make it work for us and and for people to.

We have people over all the time and I'm always thrown in wild game, and they're like, oh, okay. And so I love it when they're surprised and really like [00:41:00] it.

Brian Krebs: Yeah, I, that's, I've done that a couple of times. I'm always hesitant cause I don't know, I've, maybe I shouldn't be, but I'm always worried that like someone is going to have a strong aversion to wild game.

Like they'll eat meat. But not Wild Game and so I'm like, I don't know, and especially with some of these newer things that I was trying, like I was really trying to figure out how to cook shanks, so I didn't have to butcher them, but it took a while to refine the process so you don't end up with a big glob of gelatin tendon in your barbecue sandwich, and so once I got through some of those and I got comfortable cooking for others that way, and then to hear them be like, this is wild game, and not only wild game, it's like one of the what people would think is the worst cuts, too.

Most, I know people that, sadly, throw the shanks away, because they don't want to deal with them. Oh. And it's it's, I've, Oh, good. It, the, that's what I'm saying. I take them all for our group. Our group we I said, Hey, it's really easy to just cut them off and slow cook them. They pull apart and everyone's just if you want them, you can have them.

So if we shoot eight deer in our deer camp, I get [00:42:00] 32 shakes, which is a lot.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah. Wow. It makes such like a good, rich sauce too, just not just like pasta sauce, but you could do such good Mexican, mole is with it, tossing it with a. Mole or a ragu and stuff like that just There I think there's so much more people they're small.

There's not a whole lot of meat to a lot of the shanks so people freak out about that, but I feel like It's very underrated. Another underrated thing that people just don't want to deal with.

Brian Krebs: Do you make broths and stock with, I guess I should ask the difference first. But do you use the long bones to make to make like soup stock or soup broth with?

Jamie Teigen: We like cut them up, put them in there, like a stock. Yeah, we just like, the long bones, we just cut in half or in pieces, just so it can

Brian Krebs: render out. To get the marrow, to open up access to the marrow, and then so [00:43:00] you would throw that in with, Sure. I'm sure it's water based, but then all your vegetables and seasonings, however, you're gonna make your stock base and So you utilize all those long bones?

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, then just strain it out. I personally don't like eating bone marrow. It's a texture thing to me, for me. But yeah, just strain it out. I think it has a lot of really rich flavor.

Brian Krebs: Adds a lot. That's one thing my wife wants to try this year is to make some of our own she loves soup.

Personally, I could do without soup. I like thicker soups, like chili or like a real hearty beef stew, but like chicken noodle soup to me is just like soggy noodles in warm water.

Jamie Teigen: That's funny.

Brian Krebs: And I know it's just me, most of America loves chicken noodle soup,

Jamie Teigen: oh, that's funny.

Brian Krebs: But she wants to do that, and so I'm just thinking through what we would do, and obviously I would use like the femur bones. For it, the bigger bones and stuff like that.

Jamie Teigen: Now that you're going to have a quarter acre garden.[00:44:00]

Brian Krebs: Next year we're going to have a lot of, yeah, we could potentially have I would love to be completely self sufficient on food. I think it would be a ton of work and we both have day jobs so it probably wouldn't happen. But I was even thinking about doing like an aquaponic system where we're growing vegetables on a water system, like floating garden beds and raising fish or shrimp underneath.

Thanks for watching! Sure. Wow. I love that idea. That's a,

Jamie Teigen: yeah, that's a

Brian Krebs: lot. It is a lot. And my wife doesn't like shrimp,

Jamie Teigen: oh, she probably never would have gone out there if those were crawling underneath.

Brian Krebs: You wouldn't, I think you'd have to do smaller tanks, so you'd never have to interact with the shrimp.

You could just float the beds over, but it works really good. I've researched with like lettuce and all of the very high water content vegetables. So it's something to think about. You'll have to look that up. Maybe. I don't know. It's a very expensive that's not a gardener. Then you're like a hatchery or a fish raiser.

[00:45:00] But yeah, so what, you mentioned something earlier that. That I had an idea and I want to come back to it, but what you were talking about saving different cuts or different parts of different animals because you want to try new recipes. And what I was wondering is did that get very intense while you were doing the content for outdoor class where you're like, Alright, I'm going to need one of these and I'm going to need one of these and I'm going to need this type of animal and this cut and this leg and don't eat that.

That's, we're saving that for outdoor class and trying to gather all of these different things.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, because you need two of everything. Oh, yeah, just because if you I mean for TV stay safe or whatever like for because I have a couple recipes that Are like slow cooker So you have to do one ahead of time and then do one like the prep for one and then you show The final

Brian Krebs: right?

Oh because you were you doing it all in I was at a house. [00:46:00] Okay. But it's this is when the film crew is showing up like this slot of time. So we got to do it. Yes. It's not like I can take my time and film this part tonight and this part

Jamie Teigen: tomorrow. Yeah. So I did the ragu that I did.

That takes eight to nine hours. Oh boy. So I had to do that ahead of time. Like day before and then at 7 a. m when we go to film I would have essentially we would go through all of the prep and then do the final dish like Taking it out of the oven and hey, or you know out of the slow cooker. I can't even remember what I did, but Here's the final dish so To cut that process down so it's not nine hours of filming one recipe you had to do a couple things like that, but there's two, two recipes that like were a longer process that I had to have a couple things like I did like heart processing a heart.

So I'd have two hearts to get different shots of each of those to make sure we didn't [00:47:00] miss anything. And and then cooking a heart after that.

Brian Krebs: Interesting. Yeah. Interesting. Let's back up and just give a quick overview of what outdoor class is and then what your outdoor class is, just in case, we had John Barclow on that did the backcountry mission planning, but in case someone didn't hear that episode and they're hearing about outdoor class for the first time.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah. Outdoor classes, essentially an e learning platform for really professionals in the hunting industry, whether you're new to hunting, you like literally know nothing about hunting, you're seasoned in it. This platform is really good for that person. Because you're learning about mule deer, you're learning about.

I teach classes about how to cook. And so my class is about cooking the wild game that you harvest. And the recipes that I do are things that we typically have in our pantry. So they're not like, [00:48:00] Recipes that I go through and you're like, I, there's no way I can do that, but I can do, but I have this and this and my pantry.

Yeah, I can do this. Literally right now if I wanted to and so that's how I approach it because I don't want even like cooking classes that I do here in Bozeman. I go about it that I want you to be your own master chef in your kitchen. And I want you to go home to feel comfortable with these recipes and you're like, 100 percent confident that you can do it.

I don't use ingredients that have to be shipped across the world or, something like that. I use, ingredients that you can get at your local grocery store. And if there's not a, I used elk, antelope and venison and most of the courses that I did and, but you can interchange if you don't have antelope use venison or, whatever.

So they're very like. Overlapping [00:49:00] as far as like wild game goes that you can use. I just really want people to understand that like when I do courses, I want you to take the course that you learned from Randy and Remy and Corey Jacobson and John. Using those skills in the field and then coming back and being 100 percent comfortable and using my recipes, Bree's recipes, Hank Shaw's recipes and just making some really fun things.

Brian Krebs: I like that you had an emphasis on maybe what would be more so like an everyday recipe where it's like You come home from work and it's what are we going to make? Oh, I'm going to make, Jamie Tegan's whatever recipe because we have it and I can do that. And that's the, not to maybe put myself too far out on a ledge, but that would be like maybe the one criticism I have of the meat eater cookbook is like everything looks delicious, but I'm like, nope, I don't have that.

Don't have that. Don't even know what that is. Don't know how to pronounce that word. Oh, venison chili. Okay, we'll make that one. And so it's like [00:50:00] a lot of these cookbooks. It's like it's a little bit too. Too detailed, maybe too nuanced, like probably tastes delicious. Especially if I had You know, the author cook it for me and blow my mouth off, but I'm not that chef.

I'm like a three ingredient chef. My wife is better than I am. But we got to keep it simple because I'm not very good at cooking.

Jamie Teigen: And two I don't like saying fancy words in a recipe because you just call it a sauce or you call it a tomato sauce or you call it something like that. Because nobody's going to know what a veloute is.

Unless you're like, yeah, so it's I I want people to be comfortable and like literally seeing the recipe and being like. Okay, and not being afraid of like the word ragu. I could have just said meat sauce, like a slow cooked meat sauce or whatever. But, I don't want people to be afraid of doing a ragu.

It's just I think people [00:51:00] get afraid of like things like that, that are slow cooked because it does take longer. But really the prep to do things like that is not is 15 minutes, right? And then you're just letting it be you go to your job or whatever you do and then you come home and you just eat It, so stuff like that.

I want people to just know that they shouldn't be afraid of You know having wild game and not being able to cook with it And having that meat thermometer that they can take the temp really quick. Cause wild game can, when you overcook it, it's not going to taste great. But if you cook it to the right temp, it's going to probably be one of the best steaks you've ever had.

Just learning those little things Brie Chef Brie in outdoor class she has a lot of great kitchen hacks, and Hank he goes through breaking down venison, and he does some really great recipes. Brie has some great recipes she has, Chili on there, you're just talking about chili.

So there's all these things that you can do together and collaborative to make [00:52:00] your experience from the field, like much better and ending at your home. Yeah,

Brian Krebs: I would, the whole point of this podcast, I was really hoping to end up with inspiring people right before season. To have it in mind of I'm going to, you know what, I'm going to do a couple of these different things.

Maybe they have time to get through your outdoor class before they go on their next hunt. And so they have like ideas in mind as they're quartering their elk in the field. Like one thing I've always wanted to do if I shoot a big enough elk or I'm not part of a big enough elk, I would love to try to cut a brisket cut out of an elk.

Just because. I know it's not going to be anything like Snake Rivers Wagyu brisket, but I would just love to try to cook an elk brisket.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, we did a venison one last year. Our friend shot a pretty decent mule deer and it turned out fantastic and it wasn't a lot, but it was great.

Brian Krebs: Typically a brisket's too big for most people.

Let's be honest, who's gonna eat a 14 pound brisket by themselves? You have to cook it when you have company over. Yeah. And so a venison brisket's probably the perfect size for a meal and an [00:53:00] elk brisket would maybe be like a perfect size for a meal and leftovers. I would just love to try it.

At first it comes with knowing how to cut it in the field. Cause that part's going to be a little tricky. I've never tried that before but yeah, hopefully inspire people to do something more fun and exciting than spaghetti sauce and taco meat.

Jamie Teigen: That's, that stuff is good too. And I just encourage people to just don't be afraid to try stuff.

If it doesn't turn out, then it doesn't turn out, but at least you're trying new things and not just sticking with. The taco meat or spaghetti

Brian Krebs: sauce,

Jamie Teigen: because we do that too. I'm not saying that we don't do that we do that all the time because it's just easy, we're all busy and but I feel like there's so many really good recipes out there that are just as easy as that you can do with wild

Brian Krebs: game Yeah if you're gonna make the spaghetti sauce or the taco meat do it because You just are craving that don't do it because it's I have all this In venison, I might as well just make it into taco meat and move on with my life.

That's just not as [00:54:00] exciting. Like the hunt is exciting. The planning, the trip itself, like we love that part of it. And then I love cooking it, bringing it home and trying all these different recipes. And maybe that's the next step is to get the outdoor class and just add a couple of new recipes to my book.

I have to ask, who was responsible for gathering all the different parts of different wild game for your outdoor class? Oh, they were all mine. All yours personally. Yeah. Yep. Oh, wow. So were you like, did you have to plan? I don't, outdoor class is relatively new. I'm sure the behind the scenes planning has been going on for years, but did you have a fair headstart of Hey, next year I'm going to be doing this project, so I need to start like saving a couple of different cuts for this project.

Or was it really alright, we're going to town this fall, because in two months I'm filming this class.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah, so I got approached a year ago November. Okay. We have been hunting, and then we filmed a year ago January. [00:55:00]

Brian Krebs: Not a lot of time.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah. So I had, we had me, we had gotten, by like December 1st, we had gotten like seven animals.

So I had plenty of stuff to film in January.

Brian Krebs: So it wasn't like when Randy and outdoor class and go on approach. You're like, sure, I'll do it, but I'm gonna need one of your antelope quarters and I'm gonna need one of Corey's out quarters and I'm gonna need one of Remy's mule deer quarters.

Jamie Teigen: No, I had it all.

I think the only thing that I did have to use was Ryan Bailey. He's the executive producer. I had to use one of his front shoulders for, I don't know, I think it was for the ragu or something like that. Just because we had gone through ours. So

Brian Krebs: yeah, that's what I was thinking. Like when you said November to January, I'm thinking like.

Man if I don't have my animals tagged out by November, just the way my fall usually goes I'm probably not getting another animal. And so it's if [00:56:00] they approached me on a certain some years I'd be like, yeah, I could film two classes with all the animals we got this year. And some seasons, to be honest, it's I'll film it, but you guys are all gonna have to bankroll it with meat because I didn't tag anything this year.

And if you want to film this in three months, we're gonna have to come up with a plan.

Jamie Teigen: Yeah. And that's another reason like I why I like full legs but like I have recipes for this next time like already set, so I know what I need. Okay. And, I'll be filming here in probably a few months, but couple months for another class, and, but I know exactly what I need,

Brian Krebs: Is there a theme to the second class, or is it just a bunch of new recipes, or is it too early to let the cat out of the bag?

Jamie Teigen: They're gonna be fun recipes. Okay. Yeah, and certainly think comfort food type stuff, like what grandma and your mom used to make, back then type stuff it's gonna be really good.

Brian Krebs: If you get approached for a third class. I [00:57:00] would just give you a free idea of a shareables theme with Super Bowl party, Sunday football, barbecue at the Fourth of July maybe think because that's always something where every event I go to, I want to bring a little bit of myself and my character personality and the hunting and my cooking, but it's like, what am I going to cook that we can easily serve a bunch of people yet It's not like I'm, using an entire deer to do this event, and like, when you get to that scale it's hard to find like a finger food, like an entree, or not an entree, an appetizer, an hors d'oeuvre something fun and unique, but maybe a small scale, because I've never seen something out there that was, like, really intentional on, on shareables, which, Every cookbook maybe has a couple a great idea, but I think that'd be really fun to just have something where someone picks it up, throws it in their mouth and Oh girl, where is this

And you're like, Hey, that's venison, or that's antelope, or that's elk, or whatever it is. Yeah, that's coyote. We found it on the side of the road. .

Jamie Teigen: It's funny you say that because Living in Bozeman, we have the Sitka[00:58:00] headquarters here. And I do a ton of wild game stuff for them. Whenever they have the GoHunt guys or really anybody.

But I always do wild game and it's always appetizers. It's never main course type stuff. I do a ton of wild game appetizers. But yeah, like filming it. I've really never done so

Brian Krebs: Would have a hundred percent market share in the wild game appetizer cook show it market industry. Really it would be an industry you'd own it because you'd be the first one to do it

Jamie Teigen: But yeah, it's like all the events that I do here are literally appetizers just so people can taste a bunch of different wild games.

Like I have a group of 12 guys coming in September and I'm doing a full on wild game like wine pairing with wild game appetizers. Yeah. And so it'll be really fun. I'm [00:59:00] excited for that, but it'll be,

Brian Krebs: I don't, I've never developed a taste for wine, so that's one opportunity for me to grow.

But I only know really one wild pair with beer . I was gonna say, I only really know one wild game appetizer, and I don't think it's the kind of appetizer you would pair with wine. It would be more like a beer tasting, but it's the simple jalapeno bacon wrap poppers with pretty much anything.

Usually I use pheasant, a white meat. But yeah, I don't know what wine that would go with, but it would go with any of your beers.

Jamie Teigen: Absolutely.

Brian Krebs: So that's funny. Awesome. Just like that, Jamie, we've already racked up over an hour talking about food, and I think that's mostly because. I really am a chubby kid at heart, and I love eating, and so am I. Talking about food, I could go on forever,

Jamie Teigen: I love

Brian Krebs: it. But yeah, I appreciate you making time and coming on the podcast, sharing a little bit of your recipes, your cooking style, the outdoor class and I want to have you give... [01:00:00] Folks the link to the outdoor class and where they can find you with your website and all of that, so if they want to start their cooking journey and maybe even a career one day, they can start with your with your course.

Jamie Teigen: So they can go to outdoor class. com and then you'll really, check out all the instructors. They're all incredible in their niche. Just, and honestly, like the instructors that are on outdoor class are genuinely wonderful, nice people. So I'm really just honored to be in this group. But yeah, outdoor class.

com Jamie Tagan and yeah. You can actually use my name, J A I M E, and get 20 percent off of the class. To, or you can find me on Instagram, it's chef underscore Jamie Tagan. And,

Brian Krebs: yeah, go check it out. Awesome. So the outdoor class code is just your first name. J A I M E.

Jamie Teigen: Yes. And they can get 20 percent off.

Brian Krebs: Perfect. We will put that in [01:01:00] the link in the show notes. So if anyone wants to, they can just click on that and bring them right over there. And we'll put the code in as well. Awesome. Get schooled up and it's perfect time really for outdoor class to get signed up and take the course because There's probably a course that covers not only your species with all the instructors But how to get in and get out with John and now we got the Hank Shaw, Jamie Tagan Chef Brie all those classes for what to do when you get back home.

Yeah

Jamie Teigen: So it's fun. It's perfect. A lot of good stuff out there.

Brian Krebs: Awesome. Awesome. Thank you for being here, Jamie. And thank you for listening folks.

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