Show Notes
In this episode of the Antler Up Podcast, I sit down with Tom Fleisher (@PhillyBurbsBowHunter) to talk about the challenges and rewards of suburban hunting in Pennsylvania. Tom shares how his early hunting experiences shaped his passion for the sport and how Pennsylvania’s 5C area offers unique opportunities for deer hunters. We dive into the importance of strategic planning, patience, and responsible deer management in urban and suburban settings, where shot placement and ethical hunting are critical. Tom also highlights the value of building relationships with property owners, navigating new state game lands, and fostering a sense of community through his Philly Burbs Bow Hunters page.
Beyond hunting strategy, we discuss the role of technology—like cell cameras, which can be both an asset and a distraction—along with how harsh winters impact deer movement. Tom also shares insights on hunting gear, from the benefits of heavy arrows for better penetration to the importance of constant tinkering for improved performance. If you’re interested in suburban hunting, refining your setup, or just looking to hear great hunting stories, this episode is packed with valuable insights!
So, grab your gear, sit back, and join us on this episode as we Antler Up with Tom Fleisher! Stay tuned, stay safe, and Antler Up!
Show Transcript
Antler Up Podcast (00:00.098)
What's up everybody? Welcome back to the show this week. I'm joined on the other line by Philly burbs bow hunter. I got Tom Fleischer Welcome to the show brother Dude, absolutely. I did it's been fun to interact with you on Instagram for the last couple years and just get a chance to
Tom Fleisher (04:56.887)
Thanks buddy, I appreciate it.
Antler Up Podcast (05:05.964)
connect and obviously being from Pennsylvania, being from that Southeastern part of PA. I got family there. I've had a chance to finally break the seal of hunting 5C this past late season with Jim and Josh a couple of weeks ago, which was kind of cool. And it's crazy how many deer are in that area. It's just, it's pretty cool to see that if you're just looking to try to find deer, 5C is a great area to go to.
Tom Fleisher (05:29.709)
Yeah, think Mitchell Shirk, think on his podcast mentioned it too. Like if you want to shoot deer, like he come to 5C, 5D, they're here. And a lot of people in the other parts of the state don't quite realize exactly how many deer we have down here.
Antler Up Podcast (05:37.208)
Yep.
Antler Up Podcast (05:42.35)
Dude, I think about last, it would have been like April. I went in to celebrate Jim's birthday party, his wife through like kind of a surprise party and on our way to dinner, we're driving by and we're on the, don't even know what highway it would be, but we're going in towards Allentown basically. And as we're passing all these fields, there's like 80 deer in a field to your right. There's 80 deer on the field to your left. You're like, Oh my gosh, they're like cockroaches, these white tail.
Tom Fleisher (06:04.983)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (06:11.31)
It was pretty nuts. And that last hunt, uh, the last couple of minutes of our hunt, was like the wild, wild west. mean, we're, we were sneaking around. We got down a little bit too early. We just needed like 15 more minutes and our gut was telling us to stick. then, you know, we were like, you know what? We would have like 45 minutes if we want to do a stock on these deer in the field. And it was, it was a blast. I mean, you can't, can't ask for anything better other than maybe filling the tag. But as far as like a hunt goes of seeing deer, I was like, dude, just hunting with you.
Tom Fleisher (06:30.315)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (06:36.8)
Great.
Antler Up Podcast (06:41.28)
Seeing deer, laughing, like that's all that, that's all I came for is, is, is that type of stuff. yeah. Absolutely. I did it. What's so funny is how excited, I mean, I know there's some people I saw, I came across a reel the other day where an individual's he shot a doe. think it was actually a YouTube video. It was a really cool video of a kid. I say kid, but he was probably like mid twenties or something like that.
Tom Fleisher (06:42.546)
Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely. Anytime I see Dyrrha to win.
Antler Up Podcast (07:07.852)
shot a, shot a doe and he was all fired up. was during rifle season. So he was probably cold, you know, that adrenaline of doing that. It was awesome. And people were like, people still get jacked up over a doe. It's like, I hope so. You know I mean? Like,
Tom Fleisher (07:19.99)
yeah, my heart races every time I got a dough in range. Like whether I'm to shoot it or not, it's just gets my, gets me going, you know, it's exciting.
Antler Up Podcast (07:23.351)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (07:27.798)
Mm-hmm. know man. So dude, let's let's do a quick little introduction dude on on yourself and a little bit of who you are and Obviously, you're heavily involved with what kind of like a little page regarding like people and in your area, which is I think fantastic So I guess just give give a listener a little bit of what you're about, man
Tom Fleisher (07:48.028)
Yeah, man, I grew up in the central part of the state in a small county called Perry County, a little town called Shermansdale. So I grew up there. Grew up hunting, fishing from the time I was 12 years old. My first tree stand was a bunch of scrap two by fours, you know, nailed to a tree. And that's where I shot my first deer out of with, you know, 243, you know, that I still have. My dad wasn't much of a hunter, but he did take me out, you know, whenever I was, you know, when back then you couldn't hunt until you were 12.
I remember taking my hunter safety course in sixth grade in my elementary school. I actually took it in the cafeteria during school time. Did that, started hunting at 12. Like I said, my dad wasn't a big hunter, but he would take me out a couple of times during deer season. Then after that, I just kind of started hunting on my own. I had a shotgun, hand-me-down shotgun that was my great uncle's. I would go out and shoot squirrels.
I was fortunate enough to live on the same property as my grandparents. So whatever squirrels I shot, my grandfather showed me how to clean them. My grandmother would cook them. you know, from 12 on up, I started hunting, you know, by myself a lot. And friends of ours had a deer camp at the Hidden Valley Boy Scout Camp on their property, which is in Louisville, about 25 minutes from our house. So back then, day after Thanksgiving, my dad and I would go up to camp and stay there.
That's where I learned to play poker as a kid and all kinds of adult things that I probably shouldn't have been learning at the time, but it was a small camp, everything ran on propane. It was just no running water. It was awesome. So I got to experience that from the time I was 12 up until I was probably a senior in college. Then eventually sold the camp, but I got to experience that for a lot of years. Had a ton of good memories with good people.
Antler Up Podcast (09:30.072)
yeah
Tom Fleisher (09:37.191)
And then I went to school at East Stroudsburg University up in the Pocono. So got hooked up some guys up there to hunt. So we used to hunt the Delaware Water Gap out there. And a bunch of us would hunt out there and shot a lot of deer out there over the couple of years. And then once I graduated college, we moved down here into the southeast to Willow Grove. And I still continued the rifle hunt. But up until that point, never really did any archery. I was always a rifle hunter during deer season. Ten years ago, we moved.
Antler Up Podcast (09:52.462)
Once I graduated college, we moved down here to the southeast to Willow Grove and I still continued the rifle hunt but up until that point never really did any archery. was always a rifle hunter.
Tom Fleisher (10:06.886)
needed a bigger house, we ended up out here in Bucks County and started looking at the hunting situation out here and realized, hey, it's quite a generous archery season, deer season that we have out here. So at the time I was like, what's going to get me in the woods the fastest? At that time, the kids were much younger, much more involved in activity. bought a crossbow at the time because not really knowing how much time I would have to devote to practicing. So that got me in the woods. And a couple of years later,
switched to a compound and just haven't looked back. So yeah, it's been good. So I really got into shooting a compound and just enjoy it. I love doing the 3D shoots in the summer with buddies and stuff like that. And it's just kind of the addiction is growing.
Antler Up Podcast (10:52.173)
Yeah. You're in a great area for some 3D shoots, just like local clubs.
Tom Fleisher (10:57.455)
There's so many down here. it's pretty much, if you want to shoot every weekend in the summer, you can. There's somewhere to go.
Antler Up Podcast (11:02.306)
Yeah, that's awesome. It's amazing how like last year, obviously I've said a ton too many times on the podcast of finally getting out and competing in that aspect of Avenue, but there's only like one or two places near me. mean, that are really close. I should say like there are, mean, within maybe and within an hour driving distance. Sure. There are multiple, places that I could get to all that type of stuff, but like you have a little honey hole where there's, there are a couple within a
Tom Fleisher (11:29.698)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (11:30.19)
35, 40 minute drive and it's only that way because of the traffic. It's probably when you look at the mileage difference, it's actually a lot closer than what it is. yeah, that area, you have a nice little spot. I can't think of the name. man, it, do I want to say like Clover? Is there some? Yeah, I can't remember if that's the facility that I held a, cause that's in Bucks County, right? Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (11:32.888)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (11:40.355)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (11:49.828)
Cloverly. Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (11:55.012)
Correct, yeah, up near Quaker Town area.
Antler Up Podcast (11:57.174)
Yeah. So I think that's the club that we held a, tethered event a couple of years ago. And that's where I kind of got my foot in the door with tethered, where, where I kind of, you know, jumped, jumped up into a higher role with those guys. but it was a really beautiful club. afterwards, Jim and I ended up having our bows obviously on us. we, we went, walked around the course and shot a couple and it's just so nice to have something around. And, you know, I spoke with one of my students today, actually during study hall.
was during lunch and he came back a little bit early and I was finishing up and doing some more grades and getting some things together. And he was like, Hey, Mr. Dinsmore. was like, yeah, what's up, Nick? And he's like, Hey, you, you hunt. I I sure do man. He's like, yeah, my, my, couple of my buddies told me like, you know, you, go out a couple, like get sick a little bit and go out hunting. And I was like, yeah. And he's like, Hey, I didn't know that. He goes, do you, are you looking for a club? He was telling me about something that he has. And, he goes, I,
Tom Fleisher (12:39.777)
Right.
Tom Fleisher (12:44.599)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (12:57.454)
I cross bow hunt now. goes, maybe you've been a couple of years when I like after graduating college, it's something I would like to do. He's like, obviously I rifle hunt. Like he killed a nice nine pointer this year. He was telling me and his dad shot a nice 11 pointer, all that type of stuff. So it's just like how, when you were saying it, you get into it, whether it be crossbow or your young age shooting a compound, man, there's just something about a bow in your hand. mean,
Tom Fleisher (13:10.433)
Nice.
Tom Fleisher (13:21.737)
yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (13:22.498)
Don't get me wrong. I love this year was I had more fun hunting with the rifle this year than I think since I was 12 years old again, just because of who I was doing with the, where I was that type of ordeal, just man, a bow trumps everything to me. Absolutely everything.
Tom Fleisher (13:29.867)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (13:35.498)
Yep.
Yeah, yeah, there's a few spots down here. I have a shotgun, you know, can take out, or obviously you can use straight wall cartridge guns down here as well. A few spots I could, but it's tight. There's a lot of homes and kind of the way I look at it, the less noise, the less, you know, known I can be to other folks, the better. You know, my landowners are great. Like there's, I've met some awesome people over the years and, but I'm kind of at that point now where I've
Antler Up Podcast (13:42.477)
Mm-hmm.
Antler Up Podcast (13:54.082)
better.
Tom Fleisher (14:06.944)
shot a bunch of deer with a rifle and I'd almost rather have a bow in my hand than a rifle and just having that proximity and having deer close to you, just something about that where shooting one at 250, 300 yards, that's fun, but it's just different. It's all good, archery's just different.
Antler Up Podcast (14:22.46)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, dude. So, want to, I want to bring up that article. Cause I said, when I, when I read it, I loved it. I thought it was really cool. and I think it's, it's a great, leadway into introducing, putting it on radar to some people, you know what I mean? Whether I would say more good than, than bad. know some people have might have their opinion about it. but you were contacted by the Philadelphia Philadelphia inquire, about running a story about it. You know what?
How did that come about? guess maybe you were like, what transpired after that? Did you hunt that area at all? Like what did any feedback from, that specific situation from this past year?
Tom Fleisher (15:07.259)
Yeah, like you mentioned earlier, I also am a coadmin on the Philly burbs bow hunters page, which is a page where we kind of highlight everybody's successes, you know, here in the southeast part of the state, whether it's, you know, mainly archery, but you've got a lot of guys do hunt with with rifles or whatever have camped up north. So, you know, we kind of expanded it to include rifle harvest and stuff like that. But for the most part, it's archery oriented kind of page for this, the Philly suburbs, you know, so.
They had reached out to us at the page and they caught wind that the game commission was going to be opening a new state game lands within the city limits of Philadelphia and kind of wanted some feedback. Obviously, they had gotten some feedback from neighbors and people in the area, but they wanted the point of view from a hunter, what they kind of thought of this whole situation. So, yeah, we were more than glad to talk to them.
I think it's a good thing. There's a lot of hunters. I don't think people realize exactly how many outdoorsmen there are in Philadelphia area. There's a ton. So it's a great opportunity for folks there to not have to travel a million miles to find somewhere to hunt locally. As it turned out, we did have some people had some success there over the years and submitted some photos to the page. So yeah, that's great to see.
Antler Up Podcast (16:17.422)
Right. Nice.
Tom Fleisher (16:29.542)
So it was good, but they did a really good job. came out, they wanted to actually gain some knowledge about how are people gonna hunt here safely and all that kind of stuff. So they came out, I showed them, this is a hang on tree stand. This is why you shoot from the elevated position down towards the ground so it's very safe. Yeah, so I think they did a good job and hopefully it resonated with some folks.
Antler Up Podcast (16:54.622)
Yeah. Yeah. Like reading it, wasn't biased by, I didn't think it was biased by any means. You know what I mean? They definitely were just kind of bringing it aware and it was cool to, they interviewed you specifically, but also like got that hunter's point of view and.
Tom Fleisher (16:59.898)
No, not at all.
Antler Up Podcast (17:09.134)
You know, that suburban thing, obviously seek one. there's so many now down, especially down South that are doing it. and their channels are, I mean, it's funny cause I, I, I'm not on YouTube as much as I used to be, I would say from a couple of years ago, consuming the content, heck, even like listening to the podcast and stuff as much as I used to, just with family and other obligations type of stuff. But it's like, man, I saw that one and it was like, that looks interesting. And you go on and you look at subscribers and their
like hundreds of thousands, like, holy hell, like, man, they're, they're, they're, that's huge. You know I mean? It's, it's, it's pretty cool to see that. And, know, you're, you're doing it. Like you said, you have property owners and, so I do want to get into that, but like this pasture, you had a, you had a blast. you had a kind of like an end of year post. I saw the other day of, you know, some, some success, with some doughs filling your buck tag. filled your buck tag pretty dang early this year.
Tom Fleisher (17:40.463)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (18:03.099)
Yeah, it was early. I look back, it was September 25th, which and I missed I missed the opening day down here was whatever that Saturday prior was. My son had a football game at college, so we I skipped out on the opening day. We went to that. But yeah, I'm a big fan of trying to get them in their early season patterns. The spot I killed him in is a historical spot. I've been hunting there for a couple of years now. It's a really good spot on the trend. There's a transition.
Antler Up Podcast (18:06.178)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (18:11.8)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (18:24.142)
This is what I do.
Tom Fleisher (18:32.271)
between a thicket and a kind of like an oak flat. There's a lot of chestnut oak acorns in there. So the deer come out and feed on those. It's been as far as shot my deer last year as well. But that was during the rut, I shot him. I caught some of your podcasts with Tom earlier. You guys were talking about trail cameras and he had two really nice bucks within like five yards of his camera and didn't trigger. Last year the buck I shot.
Antler Up Podcast (18:35.692)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (18:45.062)
Okay. Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (19:01.176)
The day I shot him, I saw five bucks that day. And out of those five bucks, none of them walked past the camera that I was hunting near. So, just goes to show you, and I get caught up in that sometimes, because I run a fair amount of cameras down here too on these properties. Just because you're not seeing a deer in your camera doesn't mean you shouldn't go hunt that spot. Especially if you kind of have an idea of what's in the area.
Antler Up Podcast (19:08.502)
Right.
Antler Up Podcast (19:19.433)
Right. Yeah. That's what I mean. Like that is huge. mean, for myself, I think to the area in Northeast PA where I hunt a lot, I have a camera somewhere on like a travel route basically and on a, on a scrape. And I mean, my dad and I were like, Holy heck. mean, there's deer on it all the time. And then you look to the left about 25, like think of a, of an oval shape.
from all the way up to maybe 60 yards, I would say. And that little spot that is the cameras looking, let's say, from south to north, basically from same going up the same way, but just a little bit west of that. My gosh, it was just destroyed more scrapes, rubs. And it's like, you're not seeing any of that. And I'm, and you, you know, some of the deer that I'm not getting on camera or walking over there a hundred percent.
Tom Fleisher (20:13.228)
absolutely. Yep.
Antler Up Podcast (20:16.088)
just because my dad had a field day one day in there this past year were actually two days with just nuts, with rut activity. And it's just like, okay, well, you, you know, you're, you're getting good images, but you're still not getting everything. And yeah. So yeah, I, I agree. And, you know, that's, that seems to be the trend right now that a lot of people are talking about is like the technology and in hunting and all that type of stuff.
Tom Fleisher (20:31.65)
You're not getting it.
Antler Up Podcast (20:43.32)
I don't know, dude, it is what it is. And you know, it's, why either you tend to use it or not use it and have at it. Right.
Tom Fleisher (20:49.624)
Yeah, yeah. I think I had nine cell cameras out this year. I like them. Keeps so you don't have to continually go into an area, which is nice, but it is easy to get caught up into like, all right, well, this camera has been hot, let me hunt that. And sometimes it isn't always the best, you know, the best move. it's, you got to kind of slow yourself down and, you know, kind of, you know, rein yourself in at times and just be like, all right, which.
Antler Up Podcast (21:05.325)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (21:09.705)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (21:17.558)
which spot makes the best sense based on the wind. try to, and I do a lot of presets, obviously, I out of a saddle. I've been doing that for the last three four years, predominantly hunt out of a saddle, of transition from climber to hang on to saddle. And now I'm pretty much exclusively out of a saddle. So I've gotten a lot of presets. I'll just set sticks. That way I climb up, set my platform, and I'm ready to go. But down here, our prevailing wind is out of the north, northwest. So I have a lot of my sets set up based on that wind.
Antler Up Podcast (21:44.076)
Mm-hmm.
Tom Fleisher (21:45.59)
When I have enough spots where if the wind doesn't work for one spot, can bounce around somewhere.
Antler Up Podcast (21:49.258)
Nice. What a, so what are any good key takeaways from this year that you, know, you kind of like good things happen or like how you were saying earlier, it was kind of a historical spot, like for that buck, you know, although it was earlier in your prior was, was more middle late during the rut. like anything that, know, you got a good seal of approval and looking forward to some other things with it.
Tom Fleisher (22:01.685)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (22:12.318)
Yeah, was able to, like that spot I shot my buck, a number of times I got beat there. don't know, a bunch of times I would get beat just by a few minutes. I would have deer coming in, but by the time they got in range, it was after legal shooting. So, and not only that spot, but a few other spots I hunted too, same thing. Like I had deer underneath me at dark, you which is great, but you can't shoot them then. what I did was about, I set up a preset about 60 yards down.
Antler Up Podcast (22:17.774)
Okay.
Antler Up Podcast (22:36.626)
Right.
Tom Fleisher (22:42.037)
from where my one preset is and, you know, right on the trail and that worked out good. You know, I had opportunities there, you know, and it's, you know, I'm still figuring these properties out, you know, finding different travel routes and different, you know, where they come out and stuff like that. So I'm always learning through a camera up there and kind of, you know, got a gauge of what was going on and was able to get me in the game, you know, to get them before they historically got to where I was set up before.
Antler Up Podcast (22:59.064)
Right.
Antler Up Podcast (23:11.99)
Yeah. What about some challenges that you face just because man, I don't call it suburban hunting because sometimes when I hunt a spot here locally, I only hunted it once this past year. and I ran into a challenge, I guess you could kind of say of someone walking on the property and doing all that type of stuff. it's like, man, kind of blew up the spot after a quick kind of after working after that, I was like, I'm not even coming back here. I'm not, I'm not dealing with it. So like with that.
Tom Fleisher (23:38.14)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (23:41.432)
There's always challenges, especially in that suburban atmosphere. Anything this year that you dealt with?
Tom Fleisher (23:49.203)
No, nothing crazy, just more, I would call it nuisance type stuff. I'd be set up on a property and the neighbor would decide he's gonna come out and rip around on his dirt bike at like 4.30 in the afternoon, like a half hour before shooting light is over. Stuff like that, where it's like just from my own quality of just wanting to be out there and kind of enjoy the outdoors and listen to the birds and just kind of listen to the woods. I got to listen to some guy rip around on his dirt.
Antler Up Podcast (24:17.442)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (24:18.108)
for a half hour. It's just frustrating, but that's hunting in the suburbs. And does it really affect the deer? Probably not, because they've heard it a million times before. It just more drives me nuts than anything. outside of that, really... And some of these properties are... Some are bigger. Obviously, some of them are much tighter. So you always have to worry about property lines and things like that. But by...
Antler Up Podcast (24:28.344)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (24:47.698)
You know, pretty by good margin, my interactions with any other property owners or anything like that has been good. Yeah. And luckily, a lot of my property owners are on board here, recognize the fact that we do need to harvest, you know, a fair number of deer, the reading landscape. You know, I just got an email from my one property owner, you know, a couple weeks ago, she's like, where are you at? There's like five of them in my flower bed, like right now. So, you know, I try to.
Antler Up Podcast (24:53.912)
That's awesome.
Antler Up Podcast (25:12.806)
That's the heart that's that that's got to be probably like obviously when you talk about food, right? Especially early season but man like that's the other aspect of like what are her were these deer heading? Towards as far as people's yards and all that type of stuff like that's that's another little challenge to you I mean it could be easy obviously but easy quote-unquote but like also a challenge because it's like man I got tons of acorns around me, but they're destroying this lady's bush
Tom Fleisher (25:34.523)
Mm-hmm.
Tom Fleisher (25:42.095)
Yeah, Austin is whatever. Now, yeah, like you said, early season, there's tons of food. Some of the places I hunt, there's a lot of hunt, there's a lot of greenbriar, there's all kinds of browse, like, whatever browse. you know, I'm fortunate there is some ag here in the area, not a ton, but the one property I hunted had soybeans, like huge, you know, and how many acres?
Antler Up Podcast (25:42.37)
That sounds funny actually saying that, but I had to do that. I had to do that, but no, go ahead.
Antler Up Podcast (25:57.122)
Mm-hmm.
Tom Fleisher (26:09.816)
these fields are, but they had soybeans. that was, I was able to set up on travel routes to and from the, you know, the beans. Another property had corn that proved to be a much more challenging property to hunt early seed until that corn came down, you know, up until then they were just living in the corn. Cause it was food and, and cover for them. So, and just seemed like it took them forever to get to that point where they're to take the corn down. But the day they did, like I was in there.
Antler Up Podcast (26:11.342)
wow.
Antler Up Podcast (26:23.246)
or keep it, you know?
Antler Up Podcast (26:30.35)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (26:36.622)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (26:37.871)
You know, and I saw a deer that day. I wasn't able to capitalize, but it definitely changed up, you know, their pattern. And I think this was a very dry year too, which kind of made things even a little bit more challenging. I had a couple properties with water, was able to hunt those a few times. And along that with the weather, like this late season, I think I've hunted more this past late season than I think I ever have, but...
Antler Up Podcast (26:59.549)
And along that with the weather, like this late season, think I've run it more in this past week season than I think I ever have. But this is probably one of the hardest winters we've had.
Tom Fleisher (27:06.767)
This is probably one of the hardest winters we've had, at least here in the Southeast, that these deer have had to kind of manage in a number of years. We've had snow, we've had significantly colder weather. It kind of forced them to be on their feet and definitely work that bed to food pattern. So if you had a spot, like after hanging and hunting from September, October, November,
Antler Up Podcast (27:17.129)
Yeah, I agree Yeah
Tom Fleisher (27:34.324)
and even some of December, by the time January rolls around, I just want to go sit my butt in a ladder stand. And I call them easy button stands, or I can just get bundled up, out there and sit and catch some deer between four and five at night and capitalize.
Antler Up Podcast (27:48.129)
Yeah. Do the one aspect I think that gets overlooked with suburban to a point. I remember people brought it up a couple years ago, but it's the one aspect is the accuracy of shot placement. You know what mean? Just because it's like you were saying, it's good to know
Tom Fleisher (28:01.229)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (28:04.536)
who, who like you might have permission on property A, but on property B could be someone that allows you to go retrieve your deer if it runs on there, but then property owner C could be a total asshole. And you know I mean? That type of ordeal. mean, that's, that, that's a key thing because dude, like what's a, what is there a property that is too small for you?
Tom Fleisher (28:16.32)
Yeah. Yep.
Tom Fleisher (28:27.404)
Now I hunt some of their like two and three acres, know, really small ups. Like I have a bigger one that's it's over 80 acres and I can only hunt like a portion of it, but it's plenty big. I have a property, literally a stone's throw from my house that's for maybe four acres. you know, I shot a couple of deer there this year, you know, so it's but yeah, making good shots on deer, making sure that deer goes down in 20, 30 yards is key.
Antler Up Podcast (28:56.014)
Mm-hmm
Tom Fleisher (28:57.004)
Couple years ago, I knew I made a bad shot on Adele. I knew it was back. I knew it was guts. I knew I just had to give it time. Backed out right away. in the next morning and luckily found it in its first bed. So had I pushed it, who knows where it would have went. Like you said, you get into these situations where some people may or may not let you go do what you have to.
Antler Up Podcast (29:09.998)
guys.
Antler Up Podcast (29:16.364)
Yeah, trekking around. Yeah. Like you said, man, the less people know that you're there, the better. That's, mean.
Tom Fleisher (29:22.953)
Yes, yeah, try to be stealthy about it. That's why I like to bow over the gun, just less people know what I'm doing the better. Not that I'm doing anything wrong, it's just less people, the better.
Antler Up Podcast (29:30.348)
Yeah. Right.
Antler Up Podcast (29:35.832)
What about any like misconceptions about the suburban hunting thing? Like, cause I mean, like with you running, like being part of that page and you said there's, mean, there's thousands of people on it. You know I mean? And there's tons of stories and, any misconceptions that people you think might have about it.
Tom Fleisher (29:42.228)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (29:50.827)
it's not easy. I would say it, it, it, sometimes from the outside, it looks easy, you know, and, you know, but, and it's, it's amazing though, the number of people that hunt down here, a lot of people still only shoot one deer, maybe a buck and a doe, but you know, there's not that many people down here will buy their allotment of doe tags and fill them all. You know, I have some buddies that will, will certainly do that.
Antler Up Podcast (29:52.366)
Right?
Antler Up Podcast (30:00.782)
Amazing though the number of people that hunt down.
Antler Up Podcast (30:05.878)
Mm-hmm.
Antler Up Podcast (30:15.106)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (30:19.243)
And before I was in, a couple of years ago, I was in a group. It's basically a coal group. They do deer management for some of the local townships down here. And, the name of the game is just, you know, if it's brown, it's down, you know, just to try to cut down on the deer versus car, know, collisions and property damage. you know, there's just so many deer down here and everywhere you look, there's what used to be an open field or a small patch of woods that now has, you know, a half a million dollar home in it.
Antler Up Podcast (30:35.95)
and property damage and there's just so many deer down here and everywhere you look there's what used be an open field or small patch of woods now is a half a million dollar home and you know we're a development of several homes so the habitat is dwindling, the deer numbers are know, are steady and healthy but you know people don't realize how much you know just one deer can eat know let alone you know
Tom Fleisher (30:48.235)
or a development of several homes. So the habitat is dwindling, the deer numbers are steady and healthy, but people don't realize how much just one deer can eat, let alone five, six, seven, eight of them.
Antler Up Podcast (31:05.614)
Yeah. mean, like I told you, man, like I mentioned earlier in this podcast, like I'm not lying when I say when we got down and we had a train full of deer coming. I mean, I mean, I was just floored. And like you said, man, like with the winter that we were having, it's like, man, there's a lot of mouths of feed. And I mean, obviously, luckily, that property is big and it's kind of a little bit more ag land. It's not true suburban hunting by any means.
Tom Fleisher (31:26.122)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (31:35.074)
but that's happening in your area big time.
Tom Fleisher (31:37.958)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, the deer are definitely here. Yeah, like I said, it's not easy, but if you want to shoot a lot of deer, my family and I, we will shoot, we'll eat however many deer I shoot. If I kill four deer, we'll eat four deer. If I kill six, we'll eat six. So it definitely does not go to waste. Friends of ours, they wanted deer, so one of them went to them. So, it's good.
Antler Up Podcast (31:51.438)
Right.
Tom Fleisher (32:07.304)
It's primarily what I eat most of time.
Antler Up Podcast (32:09.312)
Yeah, yeah, that's awesome, man. Now, we were just saying earlier about you with our tree and all that type of stuff. You're a tinker. You like to, you get to, yeah, you love to tinker around it and do all that type of stuff. So like for your setup, like we were just saying about accuracy and all that type of stuff, what was your tried and true this year since you whacked and stacked a little bit?
Tom Fleisher (32:17.155)
yeah, I love gear.
Tom Fleisher (32:33.039)
Yeah, I'm shooting the same bow I shot last year, which is the now out of business Athens, the Vista 33. It's a great bow. Shooting the Sirius Vulcan shafts, the 246, know, diameter shafts, nothing fancy. Just the sever broadheads, which I absolutely love. I had great success with those over the past couple of years. Just stick with those. Yeah, that's basically it.
Antler Up Podcast (32:38.36)
Yep.
Antler Up Podcast (33:01.036)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (33:02.726)
It's a good shooting bow. I'll shoot it until the cams fly off of it and so like till I get a new one but the the recipe down here is kind of you know shoot all I'll start shooting March April as soon as the weather gets decent out and I shoot a lot I'm fortunate I can shoot in my backyard out to 30 yards so I'll shoot a lot a lot of 3d over the summer and then Yeah, when I'm well prepared for whenever the season rolls around
Antler Up Podcast (33:07.948)
Yeah.
Nice.
Antler Up Podcast (33:29.937)
You have to come up to montage this year.
Tom Fleisher (33:33.816)
Yeah, I would like to do that. I'm not quite sure if I'm ready for tack yet. But yeah, something like that would be fine. did last year, for the past year, Charlottesville does a bow fest where they set up some longer courses and stuff like that. It's a lot of fun. So yeah, I think I might be ready for montage one of these days.
Antler Up Podcast (33:38.114)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (33:46.604)
Yep. Yeah. Montage is fun, man. It's like, I would say it is a glorified local 3d shoe, but like on steroids. Like, mean, obviously you could say that about tack and, but like tack there's, you know, we're, think we're going to try to get back to tack this year with Jim and I, talked about it and getting our crew back together for that. Try to get who we go to montage mountain with.
to go to tack as well, but, yeah, I don't know. There's just something it's not as packed yet. I would say you're it's, it is a little bit more laid back, but man, he has some great, great technical shots and not every single one is, 90 yards, you know I mean? Type of ordeal. So it's just like, I mean, we got to a point where last year there was a time where there were like three or four, but because of the angle,
Tom Fleisher (34:34.146)
Right. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (34:44.024)
Like where we were, there really wasn't much more you could kind of do with it, I think a little bit, but it was still fun. I mean, there was a couple of times where it's like, dang, you got to lean into this mountain to get this, this shot ready. You know what I mean? Like there were some tricky shots a little bit. but then you go up on the other side of the montage mountain and he has two, actually three, but three other courses and we've shot the one, twice already now, like back to back years. And that one.
Tom Fleisher (34:54.69)
Yeah. Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (35:12.332)
Like if you're like, man, I'm, I don't want to shoot that crazy one just yet. Or I type of ordeal, you know, I'm telling you, go to that one first because you're far the shot. It's going to be like a wide open 65 yard shot on a doe. but then it gets a little bit more technical closer range for some really cool event. I highly encourage people to really look at that. It's going to be, think in the mid or end of June, I'm hoping, I'm hoping I can make it. that's usually it's like the week after, father's day. And that's usually.
Tom Fleisher (35:15.704)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (35:23.874)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (35:27.681)
Mm-hmm.
Antler Up Podcast (35:41.622)
We usually go to the beach around that time just because we like to go early. so I'm hoping that, it doesn't land on that, but if it is, is what it is. But yeah, check that out. But yeah, it is fun to tinker around a little bit. And I, like you said, like Severus, man, it's, know, when you find a setup, I love the tinker. I love to see what, you know, what something might be able to do, but nothing frustrates me more than me wanting to try to,
Tom Fleisher (35:50.722)
Yeah, I'll check the dates and do my...
Antler Up Podcast (36:10.572)
test something out and I don't get a chance to do it. You know what I mean? And then it's like, I don't know. And then you, shoot your tried and true and it ends up you being successful with it again. You're like, dang, I wish I could have tried that broadhead or I wish I could have tried this, whatever.
Tom Fleisher (36:13.26)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (36:23.294)
Yeah, a couple years, year prior I shot the micro diameter shafts from Sirius and they shot great, killed a lot of deer with those too. yeah, and I've shot the 204s as well. So I've shot a variety of shafts over the years and I do like to tinker, but once I find something that works then we're done tinkering.
Antler Up Podcast (36:29.698)
Okay.
Antler Up Podcast (36:40.12)
Mm-hmm.
Antler Up Podcast (36:49.858)
Yeah, there it is.
Tom Fleisher (36:50.195)
Once I get it dialed in over the summer for 3D, it's like, all right, that's what we're sticking with because that's what works.
Antler Up Podcast (36:56.044)
So let me ask you this about like those 0.166s than like the micro micros. Did you get that, what's your impression on those? Just in general, okay.
Tom Fleisher (37:00.587)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (37:08.991)
I like them from a penetration standpoint. They penetrate great. They're durable because the diameter is much thinner. The thickness of the carbon is really thick. They're really durable. You can either run a hit insert or you can run an insert with a collar to kind of beef up the end of the arrow. But yeah, I I like them and...
Antler Up Podcast (37:15.458)
Mm-hmm.
Antler Up Podcast (37:21.784)
thick.
Tom Fleisher (37:38.249)
It was just a matter of, I may go back to them, don't know. Once the time gets time to pull the bow out again, maybe I'll fire them up again. But I had good success with them and regardless of what I run though, as far as a lighted knock, I do like the halo knocks.
Antler Up Podcast (37:44.928)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (37:54.572)
Yeah, Halo knocks are good, dude. I will say this though. I know some people might bash or whatever, but Jim bought these, I don't even know what they are. Just, just like a cheap Chinese one, probably from Amazon. Dude, they are actually like legit. have the switch. They even have the switch. You get, think half a dozen for like 20 bucks and do it. Well, that's, and that's what like he was.
Tom Fleisher (38:09.355)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (38:18.366)
Wow, you can't beat that, even if you use them for practice.
Antler Up Podcast (38:22.872)
doing them, using them for, because we were running halos and I've had great success with halos, but I mean, they're a little bit smaller than the halo knock. it's just like the switch that actually, think a little bit brighter, to be honest with you. ended up buying some and that's what I actually ran. I ran both like on different sets. but yeah, dude, this is actually the, the ultra one point, the 0.1 six sixes and you can see, I mean up to the flesh,
Tom Fleisher (38:23.816)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (38:30.632)
Mm-hmm.
Tom Fleisher (38:36.134)
Okay.
Antler Up Podcast (38:51.342)
to the fletching here. I didn't get a pass through just because of the angle of the shot. Uh, I mean, I had a split decision and I said, two things are going to happen. I'm either going to hit the femoral artery, uh, cause he was kind of, he was really hard and quartering hard away. Uh, and I mean, he was, I was right on top of them basically, like on a slight angle. I was like, I'm either going to drill this or it's going to drive right up in them and, and, uh, 70 pounds.
Tom Fleisher (38:55.537)
Right.
Tom Fleisher (39:05.404)
Mm-hmm.
Correct. Yep.
Tom Fleisher (39:16.925)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (39:21.43)
This ended up being like 460, I think total and up. Basically the only thing sticking out dude was I don't have it on here because when I was dragging the deer popped out this from from my pinky out was only thing sticking out of him. I just saw the light and knock and it penetrated all the way up to his heart and it split his heart. I mean, I was impressed and that was my first kill with a with the point one six sixes and I was like I'm running those.
Tom Fleisher (39:36.844)
wow.
Tom Fleisher (39:43.964)
Well.
Antler Up Podcast (39:51.052)
those babies.
Tom Fleisher (39:51.196)
Yeah, yeah, you know, and I may go back to, like I said, I good success with the standard diameter shafts this year, but the buck I shot two years ago, this...
Tom Fleisher (40:02.95)
So the arrow broke off from the end. And what it ended up doing was he was quartering away and went in straight through the heart. And this, the broadhead was actually poking up against his opposite side on the hide, but he just snapped it with his shoulder. After it went through, when he took off running, he just kind of snapped it in half. But he went 20 yards and piled up. So I'll gladly sacrifice an arrow.
Antler Up Podcast (40:05.176)
Okay.
Antler Up Podcast (40:20.046)
Okay.
Wow.
Antler Up Podcast (40:32.12)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (40:32.668)
that piles up in 20 yards.
Antler Up Podcast (40:34.722)
Yeah, no doubt. that's dude. And I was like, his, like I, when I shot him, he took off like a bat out of hell. And I'm seeing him run about, like you said, 15, 20 yards. And he was like, up, I don't know, maybe five yards to my left on a straight line. And all of a sudden he just barrel rolled like seven yards and then just plopped down. And I could see my lighted knock and he's facing away from me. And he just picked up his head once again, picked it up and then boom, that was it. And I was just like, Holy cow. That was it.
Tom Fleisher (41:01.136)
Yeah. Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (41:03.562)
And I mean, and then as I'm cleaning them out and I pull that arrow out and I'm, you know, obviously I grabbed this heart out. was like, holy hell, I literally just split. mean, his, his heart just went like that. was unbelievable. And I just said, you know, getting that type of penetration on that size deer. was like, yeah, I'm, I'm going to stick to these and, I know it's, you know, and here's the other piece too. I know it sounds really dumb and I'd said it last week with Tom, think I did, or,
Tom Fleisher (41:20.888)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's, I think we're back.
Antler Up Podcast (41:32.29)
previously with Jim, even when I shoot into the foam targets, I mean, obviously I'm shooting a huge, a lot lighter fatter diameter shaft for 3d competition type stuff. You know, I'm talking a three 90 arrow compared to a four 60 arrow, but all that type of stuff. But I mean, I was even tinkering around a little bit with the two fours that weighed the same, same weight four 60. And I mean, dude, I mean, just even the sound
Tom Fleisher (41:43.194)
Mm-hmm.
Antler Up Podcast (42:01.524)
of it hitting the foam was a lot different. And that's like, once I started doing that, I was like, I'm definitely going to try these. then obviously I was, I was lucky enough to, be in that right spot, right time and, and see that in action. And I was like, you know what? I want to do a little bit more testing with these in the years to come. No doubt.
Tom Fleisher (42:04.847)
Yes.
Tom Fleisher (42:14.744)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (42:19.237)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, think these, my micros were up around like the 5'10", 5'20". I like a heavier arrow. And with my draw length, I'm a 30 and a half inch draw. So an arrow that, yeah, I got arms like an eight, but with that heavy an arrow, my draw length, like these things are, they're cruising. There's not much that they're not gonna go through. At least they're gonna get through enough, even if they do encounter bone.
Antler Up Podcast (42:25.954)
Okay.
Antler Up Podcast (42:31.948)
Yeah, you can get away with that. That's hammering.
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (42:45.965)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (42:47.987)
It's going to be after they've already done their damage.
Antler Up Podcast (42:52.148)
Yeah. Well, dude, your season kind of like wrapped up a little bit, I would per se now like when do you start gearing up for next year and start going out and do you do any of that type of stuff?
Tom Fleisher (43:01.108)
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I just shut down my cell cameras today, canceled the subscription. So I'll get pictures for the rest of the link cycle, which is like another 13 days or so. So mainly just have him running. Just kind of see when some bucks are starting to drop. Had one, a buck show up that I thought he dropped, but here he, his one side is just broken. So he's, he's got about a three inch what's left of his left side and the, you know, he's a three on the right. So yeah, I'll wait.
Antler Up Podcast (43:21.505)
Mmm.
Tom Fleisher (43:29.804)
I don't want to pressure the deer too much. They've been on there pretty good here for the last couple of weeks. So somewhere late February, early March, before it starts to get too green, go out and all scout properties, just to see where sign was, of maybe just reconfirm what I already know or just kind of maybe find a new trail, find some areas where they've been browsing, things like that, of put that in the back pocket for next year, next season.
I look for sheds, kind of half-assed. I really haven't had much success, probably because I don't have the patience to spend the time. And I try to limit the amount of time I'm away from home doing stuff like that. So I'll do a quick scout, and if I happen to see one, great. If I don't, I don't lose any sleep over it. But yeah, this year I got some new properties I'm kind of excited to walk around on.
Antler Up Podcast (44:02.542)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (44:21.262)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (44:27.085)
Maybe I'll stumble into one even a blind scroll finds it not every now and again.
Antler Up Podcast (44:31.21)
Right. that's because that's the other interesting part for you. Is it like a, you know, making sure like I'm good for next year or is it like, okay, I know I'm good for next year, but still to go knock on some doors to maybe get a couple just in case something were to happen. do you have any kind of method to your madness as far as that style goes?
Tom Fleisher (44:51.559)
Yeah, in this like around May, June, I'll reach out to my property owners to be like, hey, you know, deer season's right around the corner. Are we still good for this year? I had one property. actually it was kind of up in the fence. It's it's a family owned property. And, you know, there are some issues going on with it. And so I kind of I kind of found out late that I would still be able to hunt there. And it's a great spot. I just didn't have a chance to hunt there. I got some dandy bucks on camera there. So.
Hopefully that one I did speak to the guy as long as everything is kind of status quo with the house I'll be good to go next year there, but yeah early over the summer. I reached out to him just to confirm And then go from there and there's a couple I may revisit, know I've knocked on a knock on a ton of doors down here and you know Some places have people on some people places are like, know, I used to allow hunting But then these guys got too greedy. They were shooting too many deer and then they were bringing
Antler Up Podcast (45:27.233)
Nice.
Tom Fleisher (45:46.453)
you know, ex they were bringing friends that they said they weren't going to bring and, know, just kind of turned into a shit show for the property owners and they shut it down. So there's one in particular was a older gentleman. So think I may revisit that with him, you know, so, you know, I always try to add, you know, add some because you never know, you know, some of my property owners are older folks and eventually they're going to want to downsize and sell their property and move, you know, move elsewhere. So I always kind of have, you know,
Antler Up Podcast (45:51.811)
Yeah.
One in particular was an older gentleman, so think I may revisit that with him.
Antler Up Podcast (46:11.5)
Right.
Tom Fleisher (46:14.566)
stockpiles of places to go.
Antler Up Podcast (46:16.972)
Yeah. What's your favorite thing from like now until hunting season? Like what's the one thing that you just love to do?
Tom Fleisher (46:24.659)
Honestly, it's probably going up to the outdoor show. Just getting to see some people, see all the new gear, a lot of new gear comes out, see what's hot, what's going on there, and just kind of bump into some people that only get to see you once a year, things like that. Honestly, I hunted a lot this year.
Antler Up Podcast (46:27.043)
Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (46:41.486)
Right.
Tom Fleisher (46:47.347)
two, three times a week, Saturday morning, Saturday nights, whatever Sundays we had to hunt. So I'm just kind of looking forward to just catching my breath and just relaxing a little bit here and enjoy the Super Bowl in a couple of weeks. then, yeah, definitely go birds. Once the Super Bowl is over, kind of, because I told my wife joking, I'm like, yeah, well, know, deer season's over. She's like, is it really over? Like, yeah, it's less. It's a little less than what it is, you know.
Antler Up Podcast (46:59.296)
Go Birds!
Antler Up Podcast (47:10.902)
It's like, no.
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (47:16.947)
from September until now, yeah, I look forward to, I'll go out and gather up cameras, get all them back in and take batteries out, get them stored away. And now it's looking forward to 3D and getting back into the swing of things as far as shooting the bell again.
Antler Up Podcast (47:34.478)
Heck yeah, man. I'm with you on that, dude. Well, Tom, man, I appreciate you coming on and having this fun, dude. It's just a fun time to just chat, hunt and stuff. And these are the conversations I really enjoy. I thoroughly, thoroughly enjoy having these ones where it's just two guys chopping it up, man. So I appreciate your time. I appreciate your insights and sharing some success this past year. And how many tags did you end up filling? Like five, six? Yeah. Yeah. I thought so.
Tom Fleisher (47:39.538)
My pleasure.
Tom Fleisher (47:43.773)
Absolutely.
Tom Fleisher (48:00.215)
You filled all six of mine,
Antler Up Podcast (48:04.11)
It's so funny just because I had another guest on earlier in the year that filled a five C tag before October. It's like, man, you guys, when I, when I reached out to you and you know, say congrats and on that stuff, it's like, didn't even start yet. You know I mean? Like, I mean, obviously you're, you're the, you're, you're unit. does start yet, but it's just like the way my mind works of like, it's in PA or like it, it still hasn't started yet. You know, it's just, it's just funny, but no, man, I'd
Tom Fleisher (48:14.479)
Yeah.
Tom Fleisher (48:23.707)
Yeah. Yeah.
Antler Up Podcast (48:32.13)
Congrats to you on filling out many tags and it's not easy. I will say that, like you said, the misconception of people think it's easy. Anytime you get in there, you fill a tag with a bow, you frigging earned it. And kudos to you, man. Let's keep in touch. obviously where can people follow along with what you got going on in your neck of woods on the Facebook page, Instagram, all that fun stuff.
Tom Fleisher (48:34.321)
Thank you, I appreciate it.
Tom Fleisher (48:48.738)
Yes.
Tom Fleisher (48:57.667)
Yeah, Facebook, Thomas Bryan on Facebook. I don't put much hunting content on Facebook. Majority of my hunting content and related stuff is on Instagram. And on Instagram, I'm Philly Burbs Bow Hunter. And then we also have our page, Philly Burbs Bow Hunters, plural. You can follow along there for all the action down here. A lot of great bucks get shot down here. A lot of good deer, especially down in Chester County area. So a lot of good deer, a lot of hunters. Our page has grown dramatically.
this season so yeah it's exciting and you know we'll keep it rolling here during the offseason but you know our bread and butter is sharing everybody's success you know throughout the season and you know it's great you know it's very positive page folks love it you know we try to keep the BS to a minimum and people seem to really you know play along. Yes.
Antler Up Podcast (49:45.765)
I got, I have one, I have one request for it. Let's do a, uh, the guys that are part of the group or part of the, the, the message of what you guys are doing. Any cool, real, you know, 3d, uh, events that any, any club, anybody that's a part of that's hosting or would like to do or doing anything, let it be known, uh, get that word out. Uh, I'll, know, even tag me in it or something along those lines. I'll, I'll share it. And if there's ones where I can make it, uh, I'll be, I'll
Tom Fleisher (50:09.614)
Yeah, absolutely.
Antler Up Podcast (50:14.178)
do my best to bring the family to my sisters and see if we could shoot. Just share that out. Let's get that love of archery out there and let's keep spreading that.
Tom Fleisher (50:20.59)
Yeah, absolutely. We'll be posting a lot of stuff on the the burbs page about, you know, 3D events and stuff like that. So yeah, there's a lot of stuff we'll be posting here in the future.
Antler Up Podcast (50:27.395)
Yeah.
Awesome, man. Well, dude, thank you. Go follow Tom and everybody else over there with the Philly Burbs, bow hunters. So thanks again, everybody, for tuning in. We'll see you next week. Antler up.
